After seeing the images of all of those Harley Davidsons riding in snow, jumping hills, climbing mountains and generally taking their riders everywhere makes a person wonder, was it a fluke that these riders decided to do things like that or was it expected, even encouraged by Harley Davidson itself?
I started looking through some old magazines for the ads and, sure enough, Harley’s ads talk about being master of both trail and highway or winging away from streets and highways and getting out to the lake. It seems taking your Harley on the back roads and trails was expected and part of the riding experience. No highway bound chrome dressers here, it’s camping and vacationing and going where the cars didn’t go. You certainly could ride the highways if you wanted to, but you could just as easily go off road. No bad boy images here, just fun with your friends and family.
Somewhere along the line, things changed. The Wild One with Marlon Brando is sometimes credited with turning bikers into tough guys, followed by an endless series of B movies with weak plot lines, loose women, bad boys and motorcycles.
It’s a crazy thought, but suppose HD tried going back to its roots, showing one of their bikes, maybe a Road King or Street Glide on some dirt road, even (Oh, the humanity!) getting a little dirty, or better yet, sponsoring a couple of guys and making a movie like The Long Way Round only riding a big Harley or even a Sportster instead of a BMW. You don’t need a BMW GS to get around everywhere, you just need a sense of adventure and some determination. These guys proved it. Maybe some potential buyers would start to look at Harleys in a new light. Can’t hurt, … or maybe I’m just being crazy.
Related: Sportster off road conversions
Doug says
Up through the ’40s and ’50s there simply were not as many paved roads as we have today. The Interstate Highway system was still an idea yet to be implemented and uneven concrete roads were the norm. Side roads and back roads of dirt or maybe gravel were common place so a motorcycle that was really used for traveling by it’s rider had to be capable of surviving on a wide variety of surfaces and road conditions. I doubt that anyone back in 1950 thought twice about turning down a dirt road to get to where they wanted to go. The old bikes were built tough and fixable because they had to be.
Even through about 1970 most bikes ridden off road, with the exception of bikes like the new 2-strokes from Husqvarna or Bultaco, were really just ruggedized street bikes, the Triumph desert sleds being perhaps the classic examples.
Maybe H-D could break out of the their image straight jacket a little by doing the Baja 500 or 1000 with a Sportster? Everyone expects H-D to be in flat track racing so why not go a step further?
todd says
If you think about it, these were also used in the wars for on/off road use. Pretty much a regular thing. I think the idea of traveling at high speed and comfort off-road emerged somewhere in the late 60’s. For the longest time a Rokon or Tote Goat was the Jeep equivalent.
-todd
Hawk says
Quite right that motorcycles (particularly Harley-Davidson) gained popularity during the 1st & 2nd World Wars. Dispatch riders were often the only way to get messages through the bombed out battlefields. Indeed, a great many of the soldiers returned home having learned “motorcycing” and probably began the movement over here.
I’ve heard it said that the person who repressed North American motorcycling in it’s infancy was Henry Ford. After all, he was selling Model Ts for only about a hundred bucks more than a Harley, or Indian or whatever. For this, you got the stability of four wheel and a, go-anywhere vehicle that would pack a reasonable load. Fuel? Heck, that wasn’t a problem. In Europe, however, cars were still being hand-built (Read: Expensive) and you couldn’t park it anyway. Hence, the “motorcycle” was much more widely accepted as a commuter. Here, it remained much more of a “fun” thing.
Then Hollywood, with people like Steve McQueen and things like the Wild One, created the Bad Boy Biker image (with a Triumph) … which most cagers think of us as even today. Very little of that in Europe or Asia, BTW.
So yes, we had our roots in the battlefields and those old Army 45’s were never expected to see pavement. Too bad the Environmentalists now have us shot if we’re found on a mountain trail. NEWS FLASH – We old bikers built many of those trails that you now happily claim as your own!
PS – I only started riding in ’52 so there were a lot of much tougher guys than me that pioneered our sport. I’m glad they did.
Tim says
you had me at “loose women”
Sportster Mike says
Great idea – lets do a journey with a Sportster on some of your scenic trails – I’ll have to borrow someone elses bike as I don’t want to get my dirty. The only thing dirty will be my pants!!
It was bad enough off road on my old Honda Baja – don’t fancy picking a hog 10 times a day – bur great idea of going back to basics.
Harley could sell a ‘basic’ Sportster with a bigger fuel tank, rack for the tent, crash bars etc (what do you mean its all in the P & A catalogue already?)
Charlie Boorman would be up for it I’m sure
Colorado was nice last time I was there – didn’t see anyone for about 6 hours on one of those off road routes
Tinman says
I see hundreds of guys loading camp gear and sleeping bags on Hogs every year. Check out the Campgrounds at Sturgis and the surrounding dirt roads, very few Adventure bikes but tons of Hogs. The internet shows a distorted view of the world, Not everyone is looking for aproval on the Net, Many are just living their life as they always have.
rtalley3 says
This is one of my favorite posts yet….
PeteP says
Trues, the environment and need begets the rider and reaction. If you are cruising down the road, and have the option of taking the 16 mile whooped out dirt road, or the 30 mile twisty mountain road, are you really taking to the dirt?
I suspect those “back in the day” guys rode those dirt roads and trails because it was it the only way to get there. In the 21st century, we have paved our way to just about every destination.
derek w says
Harley riders — gay as skylarks…
Walt says
Back in the day there were few choices in bikes: in the early 1930s Harley fielded the VL “Big Twin” 74, the RL 45 flathead and a single. Nothing resembling the off road or dual sport bikes we now take for granted. Nonetheless, the light weight of the old bikes made them better suited for off road exploration.
I love the idea of Harley owners riding new paths, but the machines have become quite obese since the 1930s. My 1932 VL weighs 529 lbs. A new Road King is 773 lbs dry and carries its weight higher. I’ve tried to pick up a much smaller bike (Triumph Sprint) after dropping it in a parking lot. A 773 pounder? No thanks.
SteveD says
Cindy Dietz is known as a high miler on her 2005 Sportster. She’s about as “un-poseur-ish” a Harley rider as you can be, and her bike has an interesting super practical style to it. Here’s her blog:
http://www.travelblog.org/Bloggers/Harley-Mom/
Jay Allen says
I think an XR12100 “GS” would be a great bike for this, Sportster Mike is on the right track. I’m glad Derek W was here to tell me what I was doing wrong all this time on my Superglide ( but he’s probably the guy in white flip flops on a 500 cc street bike )
Boog says
Check out the necktie!
Ya’ll ever noticed that even up through the ’50’s and early ’60’s the men in ads were dressed AT LEAST with a necktie and often were depicted relaxing at home in a suit and tie…(replete with the ubiquitous briar pipe)?
I know that perhaps this was overkill, but it has occurred to me that this was a time in our history where people, as a general rule, took much more pride in their appearance than they do now.
Funny that this was a time in US manufacturing where our products were the best in the world, and everybody knew it!
Personal sloppiness often translates into sloppy work ethics and and a “screw this” attitude toward whatever you happen to be working on at the time. I mean, really, would you want to employ some of the heavily “body decorated” dudes you see walking around these days? I guess that is why my first NEW car had a sandwich wrapper (with mustard stains) stuffed down in the air conditioning duct! I am NOT making this up!
Hell, it’s no wonder we are losing our manufacturing jobs to other countries…
Tinman says
derek w, If you spent less time at the Blue Oyster and more time in the real world you might have a broader view. There are Gay HD riders, and Straight HD riders and (gasp)Women riders on Harleys. Rich Guys, Poor Guys and everything in between… Pretty much like every other bike Marque in the world.
damien says
@Boog
Really? Because someone has tattoos they’re a slob and have a poor work ethic? Give me a break. I’ve met plenty of lazy SOB’s in golf shirts and khakis. Just saying.
kneeslider says
derek w was picking up on the verbiage in the second advertisement above, as, inevitably, someone would. He ignored the article’s point to focus on the minutiae.
Isn’t it unfortunate how many formerly useful words have been hijacked over the years and redefined to mean something else entirely from their original meaning.
Let’s move on.
SteveD says
Ah, now his comment doesn’t seem so “out of the blue”. It did need a reference, however.;-)
brian says
good article. A very good point that Harley needs to get back to its roots. I think that this is certainly the case in terms of advertising, but perhaps more importantly in terms of design. Get back to some older body styling and to a mroe traditional harley exhaust look.
mark says
Personally, I think “Join the good fellows who spend their play hours on Harley-Davidsons — free as skylarks, and as gay” is a bit of ad copy that HD desperately needs to recycle.
We all know HD’s existing demographic is shrinking. Here’s their chance to get with the 21st century and attract a new one!
Wuwei says
I might be interested in something like a Sportster for all-around use if there was one with a decently high and flat seat, an upright riding position, a bigger tank, and a lower weight–more of a “standard” set up. I like the idea of the simple engine, loads of torque, and tons of places for parts and service. Unfortunately, HD seems only interested in creating rides for those who like to sit in the gynecological position.
mark says
And by the way, yes, the point of the article is well taken, and makes perfect sense… but my previous post was only half tongue-in-cheek.
HD really does need to get with the times, stop marketing to the aging 1%er-wannabe crowd, and play up the all-purpose usability of their bikes. Maybe the Road King isn’t such a great choice for a dual-sport adventure, but there’s no reason a Sportster couldn’t have a set of semi-knobby tires fitted and make a perfectly good platform for dirt-road touring and motorcycle camping — just like in these classic HD ads. (Or, for example, like the Triumph Scrambler.)
And marketing to different demographic segments, especially ones that tend to have a higher level of disposable income, is certainly not a bad idea either…
SteveD says
HD could use the Sportster engine or even the old Blast engine to build a lighter standard with a traditional Harley look. It only take about 15 hp to keep a bike moving at highway speeds so there’s enough power if you stay under 80. A simple reliable engine in a decent frame with a nice seat, suspension, and bars is what many HD owners create through the after-market, although the weight is hard to change. 450 lbs would be a nice target, about the weight of the old Suzuki Intruder.
todd says
I too would be interested in a Harley version of the Triumph Scambler. Of course I’d just build my own for a few hunnerd bucks before I ever stepped in to a dealership.
Dual purpose “Adventure” bikes is one of the fastest growing trends in motorcycles right now. I think H-D would do well to jump on that bandwagon – if not hijack it all together. But, please, keep it under 500 pounds (which is still too much but OK considering the 90% street such a bike might see).
-todd
todd says
sorry, I said “dealership”. I meant “Lifestyle Clinic”.
-todd
tim says
SteveD: the best basis for the bike you’re describing would have to be an XR1200, I reckon. Taller than most (i.e. more ground clearance), decent shocks, change the bits you dont like (maybe a bigger fuel tank), and away you go.
My current street bike is a Triumph Scrambler by the way: bought entirely so I can cruise round the roads, and explore the many gravel roads round here. Lived here most of my life, and Ive seen more interesting stuff within 50 miles of my house than I ever knew existed. Just by taking the road less travelled.
The thing is, sportsbikes are cool and all, but with instant disqualification for speeding, too much traffic (most of which is piloted by brain dead zombies whose only mission is to kill themselves and me) and a way too heavy police presence on the road, I’m more than happy to cruise around on the Scrambler and go off the paved road. One of the best rides I did last year was to a place I had never been, and it was beautiful. And I was one of three people there.
Chris Y. says
Kneeslider, I’m somewhat disappointed that you have not written an article on MotoCzysz’s recent victory in the TT-zero race yet. Michael Czysz is the guy embodying everything you tried to encourage in your readership- going out there and getting things done, interesting design, use of state of the art technology. Not to mention he’s American!
kevin says
I’d be interested in a Harley adventure bike. In fact I’d be interested in a Harley “hooligan’ bike or sport bike but I don’t think Harley wants me as a customer.
I would love to have a Harley but the current line up doesn’t do it for me.
kwhop says
I have an old article back in the 40’s about two guy’s from Iowa that went on a 2000 mile ride with $13.00 between them. They spent nights in barns or under the stars, grab apple’s from trees along the way.Even had to make engine bearing repairs using a tin can for shimming material . I’ll look for it and try to post it’s a good strory.
Paulinator says
I did a trip thru interior BC on my Triumph. The best part was a 1/2 hour run on a 20 mile gravel logging road with lots of switch-backs and cliffs, but almost no other traffic. My bike gave up about 25 to 50 hp to the other bikes I was riding with, but I made ’em eat my dust:) I think a well-balanced and lightened (dual) Sportster could make an impact across new demographics, but the dealers would have to be receptive.
Big D says
My Scrambler takes me places my Harley buddies would not dream of taking their bikes. A Sportser based dual-sport would be a hoot if they could get the weight down and put on a bigger tank to get you at least 200 miles. The Ulysses was a step in that direction
Skipper says
Harley does not come even close to having a chance at the adventure market. HD would need a whole new engine to start with. The current dated v-twin would not cut it. Maybe HD should not have dumped Buell so fast. At least Buell was going to use the Rotax motor in there 2011 line up. The Rotax motor is far superior to anything that Harley currently has. I can’t even imagine myself on a Harley anyway. What a nightmare…..
kneeslider says
Skipper, I don’t think you read the previous post.
smithmotorwheel says
Thanks, Kneeslider for this article. I had never thought of this aspect before. Maybe HD doesn’t need to dominate the adventure market, just get IN it again. How about marketing the imaginary bike as a “go anywhere” machine? There’s always the potential aftermarket to make it do better.
@ Boog, I’d have to agree with you about the loss of formality in the workplace, for better or worse. My grand dad was a machinist for Curtiss-Wright, & Insley and it is rare to see him without a button-down shirt and a tie in old photographs. I’m sure what he wore to work was a little more practical, but I agree that the cavalier attitude towards dress might transfer to work quality. However, I’d bet he’d respect (and so do I) anyone that could do a good job, tattoos and piercings included. The problem is that there aren’t as many people with that work ethic anymore, regardless of appearance.
Todd8080 says
Love the old Harley ads. I’ve only been riding since ’68 but as a youngster I didn’t give a second thought to taking my Harley off-road on occasion. Pretty much all riders did. Today they’d probably throw you in jail.
Concerning the bikes themselves, everybody these days seems to want the Motor Company to do what it doesn’t do and make what it doesn’t make. “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”
Over the last century, each time Harley has offered the public smaller, lighter motorcycles, sales have suffered. Time and again they’ve strayed from making heavyweight V-twins to try and appease “public demand” and consumer response ranged from lukewarm to disasterous.
There have been many, many “small” Harleys, and some were very nice designs, but none have been successful. Sales figures from H-D’s past bear this out.
True, Big Twins of yesteryear were considerably lighter, but as public tastes evolved so did the machines. That evolution brought bigger motors, more transmission gears, sturdier frames, elaborate suspensions, increased fender coverage, electric start, greater fuel capacities and of course more creature comforts, all of which increased weight.
Even in 1903, when all motorcycles were basically bicycles with motors (hence the name), the Harley was considered a sturdy heavyweight compared to other brands. That’s their trademark, it’s what they do.
When they introduced their first successful V-twin in 1911 the die was cast and the company’s future was written. It’s a bit late to start trying to rewrite it.
Chris says
Great Article. All to often, we tend to forget our roots and see a spectrum that Harley is not marketing, the rider that doesn’t care to dress like a dirt bag. Just might have to pull out a tie and dress up the leather a bit. It’s tough to look like a badass biker with your middle aged belly sitting on the tank, might as well go for the well dressed fat guy on a Harley image with camping gear on the back. And don’t worry, most campgrounds are now paved, so those with chrome fedish will not have a heart attack.
Tinman says
Chris, Have you been hanging out at a Yogi Bear camp ground? Here in Michigan the state parks anf National Forest camps are sure not paved, and the only bike campers Ive ever seen ARE on Harleys. The Adventure bikes are parked in front of the Holiday Inn. Have you ever been camping? Did you wear a Tie as you set up your pup tent?
Chris says
Tinman, Just went to a state park camp gound in NY, it was paved, but I am sure the only tie that I would be wearing is the one coming from a rope hanging from a tree with the pipes I have. Ultras can handle the dirt road just fine as long as it is not too rustic. Actually, tent camping is a great way to travel by bike, just wish I could convence my wife of that.
Tom says
Sadly, I think Harley would shy away from encouraging anyone to take their cruisers out this way because of one word. Liability.
Companies making ATV’s are having a hard enough time getting people to not blame them when some idiot gets hurt on a four-wheeler/dirtbike. Can you imagine the ****storm people would make about a bike “not designed” for offroad?
And in the interest of full disclosure, I ride a Honda 600VLX. I use it as a daily commuter down the highway. I drive it down gravel roads. (though I keep the speed down to about 30) and sure enough, I take it out in the dirt too. Handles fine for me.
Hawk says
Sadly the issue of liability is plaqueing us all. Ever since that woman successfully sued McDonald’s because her coffe was “hot”, we seen to have an exodus from self responsibility. How about the twit who blames the GPS for “making” him turn onto a railroad track? http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080104/141128.shtml
Where has our common sense gone?
Sportster Mike says
As I mentioned earlier a Sportster would be good for this – bigger tank etc and knobblies
but the factory would have to “add lightness” as Colin Chapman would say.
A Blast powered machine would probably do the trick with Paris Dakar styling etc
What do you mean they’ve shut Buell down??!! Whoops
Last camping trip I did was Northern France with bikes ranging from an MZ 150cc to a Kawa 900!! Slight disparity in the road speed (40 mph to 140mph!!) But we kept it simple – 4 blokes 4 bikes 2 tents lots to drink in the evening (no we didn’t go off road)
and the French even love English bikers..
MotoRandom says
You know, about a year ago you COULD walk into a HD dealer and actually buy the bike everyone is describing. From just about every post I’ve read from owners, their Ulysses is the most favorite of bikes that they have ever owned. 425 lbs dry weight is pretty decent compared to the stock Sportster. Lots more power, better brakes. All gone now. I keep hoping somewhere, someone at HD will go out onto the Internet and start reading some of the bike forums and see how much demand there is for bikes they could make that are not of “the image”. The XR1200 is some step in the right direction but it needs to lose some weight and gain a little of this off road capability everyone is talking about here. They really should be looking at their own heritage and not this “biker lifestyle” that was never really theirs in the first place. Remember when XLCH was THE hot bike to own? It’s time to put the “sport” back in Sportster.
fireworks says
I don’t think HD is going to do anything about the adventure market. The old bikes were servicing a non-recreational market. Today, noone buys a bike for anything other than recreational purposes. HD supplies what people want to buy. For all Buells innovation they couldn’t sell enough bikes to justify their existance. This included models like the Ulysses. If people wanted an HD adventure bike the Ulysses and kind should have flown out of the show room.
That goes the same for a standard. The XL1200R was a good all rounder, and poof it’s gone too. Face it folks, HD building something that isn’t ‘lifestyle’ oriented are very low. You best bet is to use the parts and accessories to build your own. It would be nice if HD offered parts catalog ‘packages’ though. Something like the Iron with dual front brakes and a normal suspension would be a nice find.
Phoebe says
And people laugh at me for riding my Buell Blast everywhere and distances most people would choose a touring bike for. I think a lot of people have forgotten the essence of motorcycling, but that’s just me. *shrugs*
Phoebe says
Oops I realized I posted in the wrong thread…I meant to write this in the post about the old harleys being ridden everywhere!
Cut me some slack, I have the flu =)
Nicolas says
“free as skylarks – and as gay” was still a very funny quote, too bad for all the ones who have no sense of humor and take it as an offense.
coolmo says
The “sportster” hasn’t been sporty in 50 years. HDs are perfect for the people who buy them, but when you apply any standard of performance beyond what they use at the La-Z-Boy factory, they’re weak sauce. It’s sad really, that an American icon has been reduced to a nostalgia gimmick (FWIW, if they put the v-rod motor in a Sportster, I would buy one tomorrow).