Is there enough room for advancement in the motorcycle industry that an X Prize like competition would make sense? Envision the ultimate motorcycle, what would it be? Almost anything you can think of is a continuation of something already being done and progress would only be a matter of degree, higher speed, better mileage, lower cost, greater range, but nothing radically different and nothing currently conceivable that would be a major leap forward in technology, instead, it would be a refinement of current thinking.
Google just offered $20 million dollars to the first private company to land a robot on the moon. Now that’s quite a leap, an extension of current thinking, perhaps, but still, a huge advance in capability for any private company. Previously, a competition for sub orbital space flight, was won by Burt Rutan and there is a current competition for a 100 mpg car.
I remember the earlier Kremer prizes awarded for human powered flight won by Paul MacCready and his Gossamer Condor which flew a figure 8 course and then the Gossamer Albatross which crossed the English Channel. Those were very neat machines but of limited practical utility other than to win a prize. Where does human powered flight go from there? Others are still building these airplanes but attention has shifted elsewhere.
Motorcycles could advance primarily in the power plant, either refining the internal combustion engine or switching to electricity, both directions are currently being explored by many smart minds and no small amount of money. But how do we REALLY up the ante?
No fuel needed … ever.
How about a motorcycle that never needs to be refueled? You buy the motorcycle and it runs as long as you maintain it. Think about the idea of nuclear power plants being built with enough fuel delivered and installed during the initial build to run the plant for its entire intended life. That can actually be done, but how would you do that with a motorcycle? Well, although Ford actually drew up a nuclear powered concept car back in the 1950s, we can probably safely ignore that idea.
Do you have a solar powered calculator? No batteries ever needed, you just buy it and use it. So how about high efficiency solar cells powering an electric motorcycle? Buy the bike, flip the switch and ride off. OK, pretty far fetched, but we’re talking X Prize level advancement here.
No wheels …
Want another idea? How about those scooters you see in all of the science fiction movies, hovering just off the ground as you zip around then you turn it off and park it on the ground. Turn it on, up it floats to ride height, climb aboard and you’re off. I have no idea how that would work but, hey, we’re talking big leaps. Maybe it could be designed like those magnetic levitating trains. You would need a road built with the appropriate technology to work with it, maybe you would have wheels that retracted when you got on to that roadway. Neat idea, eh?
Think WAY outside the box and you can come up with ideas of your own but it may very well be that motorcycles do not have enough room to advance for a big money competition to work. Or could it? What do you think?
Bryce says
Flying motorcycles. Like the one in Star Wars. That’s the next leap forward. I think such a thing is definitely X-Prize worthy.
mark says
There are certainly lots of ways a motorcycle could be evolved — how about one, for instance, that changes geometry on the fly to adapt to different conditions and environments? Hit a button and the suspension extends and softens for riding dirt; hit another and it lowers and stiffens and the steering head angle decreases for sporty handling.
Also, a lot of work could go into lightening motorcycle components much more significantly.
But as far as powerplant goes, I don’t know… for many people a huge part of the appeal is the sound and feel of an internal combustion engine. I wouldn’t buy an electric bike simply because to me a motorcycle is, in part, a reminder of classic, relatively simple technology. I love the sound it makes, the heat it generates, the smell of gas and oil. Also, battery technology has a long way to go before electric bikes and cars become a really viable alternative (maybe the X Prize should be for the best lightweight battery).
What I’d really like to see is the development of small-displacement engines in lightweight motorcycles. Take an idea like Honda’s RC166 race bike and thoroughly modernize it — 250cc inline-6 with lightweight engine cases, titanium valves, etc in a stiff yet light frame with good suspension and lightweight wheels. And minimal bodywork. Or apply the same idea to some other ~250cc engine design. Aim for the best combination of power and fuel efficiency possible. Maybe use the 6-stroke concept that’s been linked to on the Kneeslider — get more power and eliminate a weighty cooling system in one go.
I think if there were motorcycles on the market with good performance (think 50hp in a 225-lb bike, perhaps) and gas mileage approaching triple digits, more people would begin to think seriously about using them for commuting instead of their gas-thirsty SUVs or even compact cars.
Matt in NC says
mark: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aISIU6rtH4o , and as for the 50hp in a 225lb bike, Yamaha’s TW200 and Suzuki’s DR200SE both are pretty close to what you’re asking for, but getting Americans to ride these bikes just doesn’t work. I just got my Ducati a short time ago, and there’s no problems with it, but I’m already planning on this bike having a failure of some sort in the future that will probably either take time to get the parts, or funds, together to repair. I’m scanning CL for either of those 200cc machines just for commuter use. Of course I can’t imagine either of those 2 bikes winning any performance awards for either power or handling.
If they have one (X prize) for a 100 mpg car, why not one for a 250 mpg MC, that will still safely carry two adults at highway speed, and have at least a 200 mile range.
todd says
Um, Yamahas TW200 (and now TW250) and the DR are only putting out around 12-15hp. That alone is the reason people don’t use them much for commuting.
Let’s see some hurdles: Flying motorcycles – with no wheels in contact with the ground how would you turn? How would you stop? Self contained fuel supply – insert a power source with enough energy density, the equivalent of 3000 or so gallons of gasoline… sounds scary.
An Xprize would help steer us to solutions to these challenges but, why? Unlike exploring distant planets or finding alternative fuel sources or getting soldiers out of the heat of battle, a bigger faster – better – motorcycle just sounds so selfish and in no way benefits mankind.
If I had millions I would give it to someone who developed an alternative, environmentally sustainable fuel that you could pour directly into an existing GAS tank with at least the same energy density as the gas it was replacing. That way I could still ride all my old bikes when we “run out of oil”.
-todd
todd says
my bad, I meant XT250, not TW250. But check out that new street legal WR250X Motard! Funny, if that motor was in a bike with pure street styling it would be laughed at.
-todd
Punknubbins says
How about some improved safety systems. I was playing with the idea of a micro controller based throttle assistance system that coupled with a hand full of accelerometers could prevent my young son from giving his bike so much gas he pulls it up onto one wheel while still allowing for optimal forward acceleration.
By contrast it could be made adjustable and you could sell it to posers who want to learn to do wheelies without actually having to pay attention to the throttle, just give it gas, and the system keeps them at their designated angle by adjusting the throttle subtly for them, they just have to deal with balancing side to side.
Adam says
When hydrogen and electric drives are developed far enough, they will trickle their way into the motorcycle world – maybe even forced into motorcycling by ever-increasingly strict emissions.
I think where the greatest strides to be made are in motorcycle safety. Gear has it’s role, but from what I see on the street, the helmet is generally the only piece of gear most people will ever consider. Evolving the motorcycle into a safer vehicle may encourage more people to consider one for work commutes. With more people on motorcycles and out of their cars congestion will decrease. If that same motorcycle could produce similar or better performance than the displaced car, emissions would more than likely drop considerably (due to the cycle’s far lighter weight).
I’m not sure what to suggest in terms of safety, but I think BMW produced a concept that was relatively enclosed. A cycle mostly enclosed would allow the use of personal restraints and airbags as well as far better aerodynamic efficiency.
So, if I were to set the goal of the Moto-Xprize, I’d set the following design parameters:
• Enclosed passenger compartment with built in restraints and impact reducing airbags – passenger should be able to sustain 30 mph head-on crash with only minor injuries
• Emissions half that of current hybrid cars
• 100 mpg
• 300 mile range
• Seat 2 persons comfortably with luggage capability
• Vehicle cost less than $10,000
Far fetched? Maybe, but the way I see it, if a single person is commuting in a vehicle designed for 4+, lots of energy is being wasted and road congestion is facilitated. Also, parking could be far more available in congested cities.
Pete says
Gotta go with Adam (in a way) – it’s fundamentally insane to transport a single 130 lb person in a 5,000 lb vehicle (not to specifically hack on the wife and her jeep).
There’s a first world version of the resulting contest and a third-world version:
First world version is carbon neutral, transports two adults up to 350 miles on a “tank” (charge, whatever), doesn’t require a helmet, cruises at 75 mph, runs a sub 11 second quarter mile, and has the highest payload-to-weight ratio. You have to produce a set of six identical (i.e., limited production run) units. The ratio issue should force designers onto a single track. Winner pulls it off by end 2008. Tie goes to the cheaper model (third party cost audit).
The developing world version’s gotta cost as much as a scooter and be built from what? Adobe? You know, the big steel car paradigm is going to be huge proble when everyone in Chindia can afford one…
Unruly Human says
I’d be happy just to see a Japanese bike that didn’t have graphics that looked like a bad acid trip.
Before dreaming about a Flying Motorcycle, how about a motorcycle seat that a person can sit on for two hours without pain? That would be a real advancement.
Dane McCray says
I would like to see a bike that is ultra easy to work on and to do what ever you wanted to do to it. The closest bike I have seen that did this what the buell blast the engine was only a 250cc but was so basic that even the average joe could do the work on it.
On another side note it would be cool to see a bike that has a zero foot print on the world. like all the stuff that makes up the bike has come from recyled materials or renewable matericals, as well as zero admistions (sorry for bad spelling).
JC says
100mpg on a motorcycle is pretty easy, and was done over twenty years ago:
http://www.craigvetter.com/pages/470MPG/470MPG%20Main.html
Take a look at some modern bikes, Ninja 250 can get nearly 70mpg, and Burgman 400 riders report 60+mpg and both of these are highway capable bikes with much room for improvement in aerodynamics.
Adam says
100 mpg is achievable, yes, but the scope of my argument envisions a motorcycle for the masses – a motorcycle that could replace the average commuter’s 4-wheel vehicle with requiring increased driver skill and still able to maintain the relative practicality of their 4 wheel vehicle.
So now you’re looking at adding weight with the following items:
• Safety restraints
• Airbags
• Passenger and cargo provisions
• Emissions equipment
• Slow-speed stabilization legs (I see the person sitting in a full enclosure rather than on the bike.)
• Antilock brakes and stability/traction control
• Convienence items such as air conditioning and stereo entertainment
All this may seemed far fetched, but as I stated earlier, if you take a step back and look at the bulk of the miles from US consumers, it’s single person commutes in vehicles built for 4+ – tons of wasted energy.
chris says
maybe i’m sounding like a broken record here, but doesn’t this lend itself more to a leaning trike? i understand this challenge is for a hypothetical TWO wheeler, but putting another wheel very close to the front wheel would maintain all the advantages of a narrow, single track vehicle while adding a ton of stability. this would also allow a bit more freedom for chassis design and packaging. I really think there is going to be a huge market for leaning trikes in the near future. maybe one built to the specifications we’ve laid out on here would be what’s needed to open up the mainstream to the idea.
pghcyclist says
how about a bike thats completely idiot proof. One that even a child could ride. A bike that no matter how hard you tried you couldnt wreck, dump or crash. Then agian that might be really borring.
GenWaylaid says
The whole idea of an X-prize implies that you’re working with some kind of leading-edge technology. Have motorcycles EVER been leading-edge? I can’t think of a motorcycle yet built whose technology level wasn’t at or behind that of the nearest car counterpart.
Surely motorcycle technology will improve, but I suspect it will happen by adapting advancements make in automobiles rather than by direct innovation.
coho says
GenWaylaid,
While Gottlieb Daimler was building his Reitwagen (a wood-framed motorcycle) to test his new gasoline engine in 1885, his one-day partner Karl Benz was working on a trike, arguably the ancestor of the Mercedes 300 LifeJet.
Also, BMW has been making bikes longer than they’ve been making cars, and when they came out with telescopic forks everybody said it would never catch on. Like TV or personal computers.
How much more leading edge can you get? Maybe it only applies to Germans.
PigIron says
The first production motorcycles with hydraulically damped telescopic forks was the Danish Nimbus in 1934. However, undamped telescopic forks were used on bikes made by The Scott Motorcycle Company from the beginning of production in 1908.[*]
[*] Wilson, H. The Encyclopedia of the Motorcycle p. 166 Dorling-Kindersley Ltd. 1995 ISBN 0 7513 0206 6
coho says
I seem to have been misinformed re: tele-forks.
Thanks.
Go Denmark!
Robbie Dean says
There has been some pretty good ideas before me… and some pretty bad ones. So, let me just say this… The question was: What would be the ultimate motorcycle?
Well, if you want to talk about fuel, we can. I think the major MPG improvements have to happen at the carbs, injectors, intakes, and gas induction ports. We gotta’ play around with super chargers, blowers and turbos to get the power we want out of burning less gas in more efficient methods. Take a look at different combinations of these and suit each combination to its specific genre of bike.
Everyone wants better gas mileage and the more ideas we put together for this, the better, but if we’re talking about really making tomorrows motos and not just winning a prize, we can take this too far in some wrong directions.
All the fairings on the 375mpg bikes may get the job done on a test track but if we rode bikes like that in real life, we’d all look like a ‘Revenge of the Nerds’ convention at the MIT Engineering Department. Let’s be honest: bikes are cool. They always have been and I’m sure they always will be. So, while fiberglass shells, like fairy dust, may make you fly lightly; if you really rode one, all the cool kids would pick on you until you got a real bike. So let’s keep things real from the start; we may want some innovations, but what we really want is to improve bikes in a way that keeps them cool and not just fuel efficient or safe. Better gas mileage does not get us to the ultimate motorcycle. Neither does safety.
If you want to keep them cool and still save gas, some touring/adventure riders buy bigger rear sprockets and save 5 MPG or so on the Hwy. Maybe we need to introduce a broader gearing range that suits specific moto genres. Everyone likes overdrive on their 4 door sedans. It wouldn’t be too tough to put several Hwy gears into commuter and touring bike models and play around with low gearing for bikes driven in-town a lot. But I don’t know if this is satisfying our pursuit either.
Some other tangents might be seasonal issues. I’m living in Michigan right now and I’d drive my sport bike all year long if it would just go on ice and snow as well as my Grand Cherokee. All the ideas I’ve seen to improve winter driving for bikes are lame though. I know lots of guys who drive motorcycles in bitter cold as long as there is no ice. What I mean is there are a lot of things we can still do to make winter riding more practical like heated everything, studded tires, snow tires, wind deflection devices and on and on…
We also have way too many people die when they hit deer on their motorbikes. How about we throw away those foolish, little plastic whistlers and create something that works?
Be honest though… X prize or not, we all like to stuff a chuck of shiny metal under us, twist a grip and take off fast. Whatever innovations may possibly win a prize- they still gotta please.
Sure safety is a concern BUT if the rider is strapped to a seat, isolated from debris by an unbreakable windshield and insulated from harm by airbags all while having computers take over deceleration and radars avoiding accidents for them… well then I don’t think I want a motorbike any more. That just does’t sound like the ultimate bike to me.
All that stuff would just drive me to go back toward loud, greasy cafe bikes that gulped gas and gave me muffler burns. No matter what kind of bike you own it’s gotta have some soul-appeal or it’ll get trampled in the consumer market.
Green ’em up… absolutely. But don’t dork ’em up or you’ll loose the consumers.
Really though, maybe the innovation ought to happen outside of the box. I know were all looking for something gadgety or mechanical but if they wanna’ improve motorcycle safety, we ought to put more people on motorcycles. Bikers tend to look out for each other in a way that other motorists do not. Wanna see more motos on our Hwy systems? Put a Motorcycle-only lane next to the car pool lanes in big cities. Get more auto-transmission scooters for the more modest riders and legalize loud pipes and no helmet laws to encourage the purists to get on their bikes more. I’d also suggest tax incentives either in the middle of April or at the pumps. Then, even if bikes never got mechanically safer or any more fuel efficient, we’d still save billions of gallons and tons of lives if we’d just all ride bikes everywhere we went.
But what we are looking for is something ultimate in the bike itself. Not in its environment. There are so many changes we could make from headlight to license plate and from hand grips to tires… and anywhere in between. Some of these might be moving towards an ultimate bike but it’s not in the gadgetry that we will find what we’re looking for. Don’t get me wrong. I’m not against improving things here and there…
Still, there is something viscerally pleasing about a primitive, minimalistic motorcycle. There is still a persona and attitude that goes with chrome and black rubber hugging a curve at 70 MPH. I think that the average motorcyclist of today really wants a piece of thunder erupting under him and takes pride in the fact that although he may be taking several safety precautions, there is still a bit of danger in what he’s doing.
It makes us feel alive. That’s why we do it. Maybe instead of using the X-prize to drive an engineering problem, we should use it to nurture our honest, primitive desires to drive fast and free and pursue a more personal interface with our machines and a deeper relationship with the road. Maybe the ultimate bike is the one that truly makes us feel like we are flying. Or maybe it’s really the one that make’s us feel most attached to the pavement. In any case ultimacy happens in the ride not on the drawing board.
If you see a guy on a red sport bike draggin’ his knee around a wide curve and smiling, well that might be me having an ultimate ride on a pretty ordinary bike. See ya’ out there.
T.H.Clasen says
How about building more nuclear reactors-the safe kind with uranium housed in graffite spheres,supposedly can`t go the China route,merely boil water more slowly.Dig a really deep hole (suggestion;somewhere in Nevada-sparsely populated,too many neon signs anyway.Bury the spent spheres in a huge,10,000 ft. deep pit.Build several hundred million electric “Morgan three wheeler”-type vehicals and have everyone plug in at the end of the day.Tax credits go to those who work close to home and otherwise conserve or even “produce energy”.Elect officials who support similar programs,refuse to borrow that they have not yet,legitimately printed,and don`t cater,exclusively to corporations and the ultra wealthy and are less than willing to export jobs and key industries to unfriendly as well as friendly nations.We got everything we need to keep going,just with a twist.