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Lit Motors Self Balancing Fully Enclosed 2 Wheeler Prototype Takes First Slow Test Run

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Lit Motors C1 on test drive

Several months ago, Lit Motors was just showing off their concept and explaining their dream of a gyro stabilized, fully enclosed motorcycle. Just a few days ago, their very early stage prototype, took its first, hesitant test drive under power. The production model, will have two, counter rotating gyroscopes mounted in the frame, spinning at 12,000 rpm, though this first run was made with only one gyro in place so speeds are quite slow. Slow or not, however, it shows the idea has merit.

Daniel Kim, founder and CEO of Lit Motors, projects a 120 mph top speed, a 220 mile range and a price of $24,000 when the C1 arrives in the first quarter of 2014. Watching Kim sitting motionless and then backing up slowly from a parking spot while the C1 balances itself on 2 wheels is fascinating. As he begins to drive forward and then stops at an intersection, you begin to think they may be on to something.

Lit Motors C1 on test drive backing out of parking space

Susan Carpenter of the LA Times, also interviewed Kim and took a short drive. Her video shows the team rocking the prototype while it maintains balance and Kim explained the C1’s fly by wire system could, theoretically, be programmed to allow a driver to perform a lot of advanced maneuvers such as a stoppie or drifting into a parallel parking space, dramatically expanding the performance envelope of a novice 2 wheeler. Hey, there’s an app for that. While it sounds pretty optimistic, I could imagine that happening and as soon as they demonstrated a C1 actually doing it, I see a lot of people quickly placing deposits.

Of course, the C1 is still a very long way from those dreams, but it’s also no longer just a computer model, it’s moving and balancing under its own power and that shows promise.

If there is anything the conventional motorcycle community should take away from this, it’s that these new concepts seem to be where the action is. We’re not looking at some bold new graphics or shiny chrome pieces, this is really new, really different and there are a lot of smart people working very hard to make it happen. It’s also encouraging, and for the current manufacturers potentially a bit scary, to see all of this coming from companies we’ve never heard of.

As I’ve noted many times, electric motorcycles have a big hurdle to clear in terms of range and recharge time, but these concepts are definitely very interesting. Honda, Harley and all the rest should pay attention.

Thanks, Steffen.

Link: Lit Motors
Link: LA Times

Video below:

Posted on Filed Under: Concept Motorcycles, Electric motorcycles

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Comments

  1. Looks interesting. I don’t know if they ever make it to the point of practicality, and even if they did. I don’t know if it would sell, but it’s cool. I’d compare it to the Carver three-wheeler. A cool tilting trike which looked like a lot of fun – but nfortunately there wasn’t enough interest to keep the project afloat..

  2. I like the construction video on thier website. I remember the gyro-X car from the sixties. I have thought about this concept using remote control helicopter gyro stabilizers to control the gyro stabilizer. Anone know if this would work?

  3. If they can deactivate power to the gyros at higher speeds to save wear and tear, and cut down on energy consumption I’d start saving up for one.

  5. How does it rest when the gyro’s stop? I didn’t notice any side stand or deploying stabilizers. It will still spend a couple of months in the garage during the winter, I hate to think it just rolls over on its side or has to lean up against a wall.
    Without power applied it looks as though it will be a bear to move around.
    I like that it appears to consume less garage space than a Spyder or trike.
    It will certainly reduce the weather misery factor for those of us in the Northern climates.
    It be nice if there was a FAQ section on the web site. They are quite innovative and driven to get something to market. I guess we’ll have to keep checking back to follow their progress.

    • Apparently, it sleeps standing up, like cows.
      I still say this thing is a nightmare waiting to happen. I’ve posted before about precession, and although there are others here who quote me Wikipedia articles on failed british railcar experiments (read those articles! not one experiment survived the prototype stage and none of them got past the intial testing stages. some never even got past the model stage), I still do not see a safe and viable system that works at speed.
      This is very much like the Monowheel: it looks do-able, it tests great, but when you actually build it, and put enough power to it to make it move right, it turns into a deathtrap. That Monowheel crash with the chevy engine was a classic! 45 mph and only then did he try the brakes….. flip flip flip flip crash.

      This thing’s crashing out could be similar, but then, they are trying to keep the designer alive. There aint no redneck “Hey y’all, hold my beer and watch this!” moment yet.

      • They’ve been working on it for 8 years. There’s a team of people. You’ve seen it driving. (albeit slowly). What part of “its in development” is unclear? Surely the principles are what allow a Segway to work?: all they’re doing is scaling it up, and speeding it up: given computer power and control technology I am not seeing other than developmental issues. I toured an engineering factory the other day and was shown a turret punch that was CNC controlled: the immense amount of power and the absolute precision with which the punches could be controlled were amazing (I wont quote stats because I would be wrong) but you get my point, yes? Computer power plus control technology makes this thing do-able. OK the thing I was looking at was 5 metres square and 8m tall, so difficult to fit under the seat of a C-1, but still.

        Tell me I’m wrong. More importantly SHOW me HOW and WHY I am wrong.

        • Segways have their wheels parallel, so they can use the wheel motors to balance. This is completely different because the wheels don’t help it balance, it relies on the gyros.

          @Dano, I would imagine that the gyros probably spin all the time. When you’re spinning a heavy flywheel at 12000rpm, you don’t want to stop it and then have to spin it up to speed again. I would assume that the concept would be to plug it in whilst parked and let the electricity grid keep the gyros spinning whilst you charge. Does it run out of charge and fall over if you leave it unplugged for a week? Probably. Maybe it has some sort of stand for that.

          • A stand is planned but it would be an optional accessory (going rate estimated at $5,000. I’m only kidding on this, but I believe Wave is correct with needing to keep it plugged in. It’s no different than us motorcycle riders. I have a small (very low power consuming) trickle charger that I connect the battery to when the bike won’t be ridden for more than a week. Most people that live in communities that ride golf carts everywhere also trickle charge their batteries when parked for the night. Not a far-fetched concept, and very easy I think to achieve. Just rig up a tiny charger, run it over to where it will be parked, and everything, (bike and charger) will stay a very small footprint out of your overall garage space.

            I don’t believe, however, that motorcyclists need to start fearing this thing, at least not yet. For one, the concept of owning a motorcycle is to allow the wind to blow through your hair. This is an enclosed structure, so wouldn’t have the enjoyment factor of a motorcycle. The price tag is also around the same as a high end Harley, so still much cheaper having a motorcycle. This will be a “gimmic” item for the rich in Hollywood at least initiallly. Maybe if they create a two person version, with good storage space, then it might give the street bikes using small saddle bags a bit of concern.

  6. I don’t really like the bubble/cockpit thing , but the gyro is interesting.
    I wonder if other bikes could be retro fitted….

    • I resent that remark Micky C.
      I’ve fallen down, wiped out on wet leaves, rear-ended by a blue-haired old lady in a pink El Dorado and slid like I’m coming into home plate on pea gravel. Oh, and the time I wiped out my B-class WR-45 on the dirt oval at the Medina County Fairgrounds taking out 20-or-so feet of slatted wood snowfence. But I’ve never fallen off any of my bikes.
      So take that you young whippersnapper!

      • take a chill pill dude,fact is harley has targeted baby boomers because they have disposible income, kids have left home.problem here in NZ is a lot of these people grew up on triumphs and havent ridden bikes in 20 years,they head to the hog shop and ride out on an over weight bike that they cant handle, the harley leathers,harley boots, harley watch,harley wallet, instant chequebook BIKIE,with no skill (you tube is full of it) instead of relearning on a smaller bike for a while.10 years ago here the over 40s were the safest riders (least crashes) now they are the worst,as a result all our bike fees are through the roof.Been riding harleys for 25 years,do all my own work, build race motors,so my comment stands, if you dont like it in true biker style i dont give a f@#k

        • You build race motors? Which part of NZ are yu in and what engines do you work on? Im down in the naki myself.

          • Otago,current motor in girlys bike (92 sporty)running ported S&S heads,pistons,carb,teflon coated jugs, modifed crank,oil system,shotpeened rods,thermal barrier coatings.Had a dyno shootout couple of years ago at MCR ,made 4 hp less than a duke 990,(still running in with stock cams and ignition,)since been changed but had a run on oped road and did 240 in 4th,gearing was to high,60kph per 1000rpm with 55rear 29 front.now running 61 rear 27 front(883) which gets side ways at 100 in the damp.Im running WG with home made intake on a mukuni with K&N,homemade pipe.If you want to go fast check out RB Racing and NHRS.140hp out of a sporty no prob,lot of fun seeing the look on jap riders when you pass them at over 200 lol. Harleys are a big air pump so its all in the heads.

  8. I find the C-1 intriguing and just think of the possibilities for customization.
    A fiberglass ’32 Ford Coupe body shell, the low-rider folks making it hop and bounce and I’m sure there’s some guy in the Nederlands that could turn one into a hearse. I just can’t wait to see them at Quaker Steak & Lube bike nights.

  9. Put an enclosure around it and now you will most likely have to abide by crash standards.. Not only that but we are also looking at the start of seatbelt requirements on two wheeled vehicles. I’m curious how this handles hydro planing.

    I do like the front steering though and any new innovation in the MC world is a plus.

    • Two wheels means it’s always a motorcycle. Motorcycles (currently) do not comply with crash standards nor require seat belts.

      -todd

  10. I wonder about cross winds. And kids at intersections that just run up and give you a good push.

    • Follow the link to the LA Times and watch the video. They push it and kick it, it stays upright. It’s designed to stay upright if hit from the side by a car. I’m sure there are limits to that, but the kids pushing it over isn’t an issue, any more than they would be than if you were on a regular motorcycle, unless you’ve been having that problem where you ride, 😯

  11. It is demonstrable that you cannot turn a bike above walking pace without counter-steering. That must be a bit odd with a steering-wheel as opposed to bars. I have read that to ride/drive a Monotracer you must first go through an orientation training session. The most difficult part is remembering to counter-steer. Interesting nonetheless.

    • Since the controls are fly by wire, you could make it do anything you want, steering in the direction of the turn, included. I don’t know if it’s set up that way, but there’s no reason it couldn’t be.

      The steering wheel instead of bars was explicitly used because they are going after non riders as a segment of their buyers and wanted the experience to be familiar to what they know.

      • “they are going after non riders…and wanted the experience to be familiar to what they know”

        Then why two wheels at all? The “familiar experience” for non-riders is statically stable and non-leaning. Put a body shell on a Can-Am Spyder or make something like the T-rex trike. If it has two wheels, if it leans, then realistically only riders will be interested. Non-riders will see it as a death trap regardless.

        I do appreciate what Lit Motors is trying to do, and the two-gyro approach is sound. However, I seriously doubt there is a market for this kind of full-up solution. Could they instead create a miniature, part-time gyro package that would make an 800-pound touring bike as easy to move around as a 250-pound dirtbike?

    • If it doesn’t lean when it turns then you won’t need counter steering. Counter steering is just for initiating a lean, not actually for turning.

      -todd

      • if it doesnt lean when it turns then I am not interested. Plus it would be less safe? Their videos on their site (the cone slalom) shows it leaning though.

      • When I need to turn tighter in a decreasing radius turn, I push harder on the clip on that is on the inside of the turn, so counter steering most definitely is also used to turn

      • The whole countersteering effect is caused by the wheels acting as gyros. This vehicle merely has a third “wheel” that spins when the vehicle is stationary. Countersteering is not actually turning the handlbars the “wrong” way, it is only applying a torque the “wrong” way to initiate a lean. Gyros react to a torque 90 degrees off from the direction you would expect them to.

        So…you should be able to initiate a lean on this vehicle by applying a torque to the gyro axle.

        • There is a lot of misunderstanding in the world of motorcycle about the hows and whys of countersteering.

          Countersteering is NOT necessarily (or predominantly) a gyro-induced phenomenon. Even if the gyroscopic effects of the wheels were cancelled out (by counter-rotating discs, for example), you would still need to countersteer, in a similar fashion that you do now. Countersteering functions to initiate lean, primarily as a result of “out-tracking” of the front wheel’s path, relative to the center of mass of the vehicle. Gyroscopic forces happen to occur in the same direction, but they are NOT the primary force or mechanism involved in countersteering.

          There is also not a particular speed at which one needs to begin countersteering. The physics of countersteering are present at all vehicle speeds, it is simply a matter of the magnitude of countersteer required. At low speeds, the forces and rotations necessary in countersteering are very small, to the extent that some people cannot percieve them, and thus make the mistake of deciding that they are not there at all.

  12. A very curious thing – first gyro-vehicle I know of was built by UK car manufacturer Wolsely prior to WWI – I expect the technology has come on a little since then.

  13. One point to consider: people seem concerned about the effect of cross-winds over the large suface this vehicle offers. But I ask, is it something worse than in, say, a Honda Gold Wing or any other fully-dressed cruiser? One may argue that without a roof and doors, an open motorcycle has less surface area to be affectede by cross-winds, but quite frankly, the human body -with all of it’s non-aerodynamic wonders- offers a whole lot more of drag.

    • For a guy like Kim, who has overseen the programming of a gyro-stabilized motorcycle that works, I think crosswinds will be a second-order term that his system can be programmed to manage in the background. It may not even matter where the center of pressure/center of gravities lie because the gyros & steering can be programmed to crank in whatever is needed to counteract the effects of crosswinds, just like counteracting the punks pushing on the thing at crosswalks.

  16. Use the flywheels as both gyro stabilizer and energy store and you’d have a very clever concept 😉

  19. For those of you pointing out gyro cars from many years ago, yes, I’m aware of them, but you’re missing an even better example, and we covered it here on The Kneeslider.

    The Lit Motors car, though, is all electric, which is, I believe, a first for gyro cars, and the fly by wire, computer control now possible may enable this project to do much more then any of those previous attempts, only time will tell.

    I doubt gyro cars will ever be a huge market any more than flying cars, but, just as the advance from Molt Taylor’s Aerocar to the new Terrafugia Transition is pretty impressive, this gyro car has the potential to leap forward in a similar fashion.

  20. Brings to mind the gyro car the Russian eccentric Count Schilovski had Wolseley build just before WW1. Essentially a large open car with but two wheels and seating for 7 or 8, it was almost impossible to steer, due to the gyroscopic force of its large flywheel. As an aside note, the vehicle was buried for 20+ years until dug up again in 1938, partially rebuilt and eventually scrapped after WW2.

    Best photos and info about the monstrosity here:
    http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/gyrocars/schilovs.htm

    • As I recall, the Schilovski gyrocar steered pretty well–assuming you only wanted to go right! I can see why Lit Motors is eager to move on to a two-gyro design.

  21. Here’s a very similar project: http://www.thrustcycle.com/

    There are a few vids floating around YouTube.

    I kinda like the concept.. might mess around with gyro stabilized R/C models sometime. A lot easier than going full-scale right from the get-go..

  22. This is a great way to introduce car people to “motorcycles” we as motorcyclists are not the intended customer. People in crowded cities are the target customers. It looks great and the tech is great. What would you rather people ? roads full of Prius’s or roads full of these things in the future ? I hope it’s a boomer !

  23. I think the person who mentioned alternative bodies including a 32 Ford Coupe has raised a great idea. It could be a very cool vehicle, but it would need room to take a pillion to be truly cool,

    Once perfected I can see it being an ideal candidate for electric propulsion with a small onboard petrol or diesel engine running at a constant speed. With its aerodynamics being about 5 times more slippery than a conventional motorcycle it could be very economical.

  24. I guess my question is how this behaves at freeway speeds when you need to make an evasive maneuver. Having a freewheel to balance and stabilize a two wheel vehicle is pretty novel. It seems like the rotational inertia required to do that would cause really large precession forces in directions you might not want when you change directions rapidly. Computers can maintain control, but it seems like it has to balance the forces at the contact patch with the road, reducing the amount of traction available to avoid what ever it was that caused the evasive maneuver.

  25. Riding that bike I wouldn’t worry about evasive maneuvers? Just smash into whatever steps in front of me, deflate the airbag, unbuckle my seatbelt and climb out to see what all the fuss is about.

    http://youtu.be/S2KjHrLbEkM

  26. I liked the comment about storing energy in the gyro as in a hybrid. Like a flywheel generator and gyroscope combined. Of course you would have to limit what you extract from the gyro but that could be managed. The gyro could work two ways, keeping the bike upright when needed(for steering), but once under way at speed the gyro could be tilted, or rather make the bike bank left or right to make it go around a curve.

  28. Carver is afloat, just not in the us in any decent numbers. Heck, they have a flying version in the works .

  29. Let’s put some Pirellis on that rascal and head for an oval. Full tilt sideways and sittin plumb in the saddle. How unique!

  30. I went thru the effort of building a 2 wheeled hand-cycle because the power supply (upper body) is extremely limited and shedding one wheel translates into at least 33% reduction in rolling resistance plus aerodynamic gains and several pounds of weight reduction. Leaning thru the turn was a cool side-effect. The higher potential for road-rash wasn’t.

    Liability exposure kills this thing.

    • Is that the reasoning behind why there are only two wheels? I was wondering why go through all the trouble and just make it three wheeler

      • Carolynne,

        I took a few slides on my hand-cycle because of a bad bearing in a crank-arm hand-grip. I could not feel any roughness or binding with my hands, but my ass sure felt the pavement. Twice.

        I fully agree with you about this effort. It would be so simple to add a third wheel and ditch the complexity. There is very little up-side beyond the David Copperfield shock value that will wear off about as fast as the factory air-freshener, but there is enormous potential down-side by taking the technical “high-road” on this one. The only thing between this machine and a packed school bus-stop is an air-bearing that supports the unnecessarily fussicated gyro stabilizer. They fail.

  31. I suppose one would be inclined to lean into the high side in a slide instead of putting yer hotshoe down and leaning back. Certainly new forces to be reckoned with. In the twisties a rider would look like the monkey on a side hack, eh?

  32. The difference between the Segway’s and the C1’s use of gyroscopic principles is very pronounced, and important to remember. The Segway’s gyros are solid-state chips, like those on any smartphone with position awareness. Nothing spins. The chip “gyros” provide sensor input for the brain which twiddles the actual wheels to keep the Segway upright. – no force involved from the chips. The C1, much like Robert Heinlein’s duos, has two (for redundancy, not counterrotation, which would destroy the purpose) actual mechanical spinning gyros providing over a thousand pounds of force to keep it upright. Precession doesn’t matter if your orient the gyros correctly, which apparently they have done.

    And those gyros can keep spinning for months using small amounts of power, I would think. The real power usage would be in getting them up to speed (then would coast using minor juice).If there was a way of magnetically suspending them in place, and be sealed in a vacuum chamber, they could keep spinning for years.