The Kneeslider

Doers Builders and Positive People

Auto Based V-Twin for Confederate Renovatio

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Katech V16 for CadillacConfederate Motorcycles started a lot of talk with their Renovatio Project, revealed a few months ago. This concept has a design that many are still trying to get their heads around but one piece I find interesting is the engine. It’s a 90 degree V-twin being designed by Katech Inc., a Michigan firm with strong racing roots at places like Sebring, Daytona and LeMans and who are also responsible for the 1000 horsepower V16 powering the Cadillac Sixteen, a showcar from a few years ago.

Corvette LS7 engineThe water cooled V-twin for the Renovatio is actually going to be a 2 cylinder slice from the Chevrolet Corvette’s LS7 V8. Preliminary displacement will be 103 cubic inches with 11:1 compression plus a target of 135 horsepower. Confederate is also talking about a supercharger so we’ll see what that does to power numbers.

When we wrote about the S&S X-Wedge engine a few days ago we mentioned that it utilized a lot of automotive style parts, now, Confederate is actually taking a portion of an automotive engine as the basis for their entire powerplant. When you think about it, the number of automotive engineering firms and parts suppliers in the U.S. does make the idea somewhat appealing. With ever tighter emission regulations coming into play, the knowledge base in the auto world could be helpful, too. Companies like Katech bring some pretty high level expertise to the table and this engine might get a few other companies thinking about a little auto to motorcycle crossover work. This one will be worth watching.

Link: Katech
Link: Katech press release
Link: Confederate Renovatio

Comments

  1. This is interesting. We have the DP1 Hayabuse v8 racecar which makes great sense for its intended purpose and the above logic has merit, too.

    I just hope someone, whether it build be Confederate or not, builds a modern, American-made, hotrod sportbike. In some respects, this bike would be the 2-wheeled equivalent to the Corvette, which means a great handling chassis, too.

    (from a car guy’s perspective The Corvette is something to admire and respect. It has style & ample performance, especially considering the price of its competitors.) ….

    will Confederate build a bike you can ride for 300+ miles/day ?

  2. This was already done years ago! Does anyone remember the “Super Vee” vtwin motor,it was basicly the front two cylinders of a 350 chevy that used chevy internals.The older SuperVee’s used a chevy timing chain cover that was a dead giveaway.Check out http://www.supervee.com someone is trying to bring it back,but now it’s an all billet job and doesn’t use the chevy timing cover,older versions were sand casted.

  3. The SuperVee has been mentioned here many times before but as far as I know the engine never went anywhere. The site they have up now has been unchanged for a very long time and it’s air cooled, not water cooled, I guess I never saw the air cooled Chevys that SuperVee was sliced off from.

    Its resemblance to a Chevy V8 may be in things like bore and stroke or some other dimensions but if there’s more, I’m not sure what it is. It is certainly nowhere near the level of sophistication of this design.

    The long ago version with the Chevy timing covers seems to have disappeared entirely, if anyone has a photo, please let us know and we’ll take a look. In fact, if anyone has any real information on it, send it in it might make an interesting story.

  4. If it’s typical American “bigger is better” why chop anything off anything? Just throw the whole she-bang in there and get on with it ala Boss Hoss.
    -todd

  5. I’m pretty sure the super vee used chevy rods,pistons and rings too. But your right it’s irrelavent to what Confederate is trying to do, but in their drawings and computer renderings I didn’t see anything that looked like a radiator,which is why I thought it was also air cooled. I think that Confederate is getting too far ahead of themselves for such a little company.they haven’t even started producing the Wraith yet, which they say will only cost $55k, some $12,500 less then the Hellcat? That doesn’t make sense to me.

  6. Actually, the Wraith is being produced. I’m in LA right now riding one around. And yes, it’s $12,500 less than the Hellcat, ’til the end of the year. Then we’ll raise the price to $62,500. We have taken over 30 deposits.

    The Renovatio bike is just a concept vehicle for the development of our new motor. I have seen the Super Vee, and I still can’t find any similarities between it and a 7.0 liter Corvette racing engine, of which we are borrowing 2 cylinders from for the Renovatio. And there is a radiator in the concept, between the carbon fiber fork blades, like the grill of a car. It’s not worked out yet, just a concept.

  7. Hey Case, put it there in between the fork and make a linked shock where the position is similar to the Britten rear shock (at the front of the front cylinder). If you want to do something extreme make the front fork act as a radiator (like a Buell rear swingarm) 😉

  8. I have a Super Vee. It was recently refurbished by Madison Motorcycles in Ruckersville, VA. Paint was touched up by Webster Designs also in Ruckersville. If you would like me to forward some pics, let me know.

  9. in walnecks classic cycle trader there is a co. that sales the super vee engine- supereagle 714-393-4025 huntington beach ca. they don’t have a web site. is this motor anything to look at – reliable?

  11. I remember an Indian prototype that was built using the Super Vee engine back in the nineties.
    This was before gilroy were granted the name rights in the courts. Bob Stark built the bike using lots of his Indian parts. The bike had a Chev like timing cover and would have made a fast, good sounding Harley rival with its big 90deg motor.The judge awarded the name to the company who could make production first so the gilroy bikes were rushed together as Skirted harleys with S&S motors.
    I have a picture here somewhere..

  12. I am in S.W. Florida and just today parked next to a Super V engined H-D extended frame bike. Owner says it was originally built by Hughes Aircraft. I took a picture of both sides and will gladly forward to anyone but I dont know how to put in on the internet. Unfortunately I didnt ask the owner his name or address as I was just so amazed over this all I wanted to do was to get home and look it up on the internet. I have been around H-Ds for 50 years and this is a first.

  13. I have a Generation 1 SuperVee (1988). This is the one with the “chevy” timing cover. These motors use all GM parts inside, from pistons to the main bearings. Valves, lifters, pushrods, cam bearings, rings,etc. all can be purchased at your local auto parts store for cheap. Of coarse, like a small block chevy engine, there are vast amounts of performance parts that will also bolt on. However, you will need a good machine shop to work out some of the manufacturing problems not addressed by the original manufactuers in their haste to bring it to market. Not major problems, but enough to give it a bad rep (especially with the HD crowd) and effectivaly kill the production line. The lousy customer service didn’t help either. After over 15 years of producing the SuperVee ( Generation 1, 2 & 3) there are only approx. 250 of these engine/frame in existence today, making them collectors items.
    After taking care of the extra machine work and building it properaly, my SuperVee roars like a 427 corvette and has more torque and power than any other V-twin out there (yes, including Harleys and all their clones). Quite the conversation piece at all rides and shows also. I love to blow away other bikes after everyone has dissed my SV. They just shake their heads and mumble thier disbelief. LOL
    JD

    SuperVee
    http://lh4.ggpht.com/SuperVmax442/SJLNqHB5Z2I/AAAAAAAAA2w/5J0pBWI9i-g/df_1_b.jpg

  14. I watched the Super Vee since they first tried to market it, and waited and waited until they could get it “right.” Nostalga sold the rights to another company, who, to the best of my knowledge, haven’t produded one yet. If you have one that works, I’d like to chat with you.

    As for the Renovatio, I don’t expect it to go far looking as planned…

  15. i have the generation 1 supervee.lost the harmonic balancer that hung out there.its been sitting out in the wheather the last 10 yrs.been thinking of tearing it down and trying to rebiuld it because rain got in it from exposed parts.
    i never got it running right.the distributor had points with a coil[harley] that fired to both cylenders at the same time.the rear cylinder would ignite the fuel with the intake valve open
    when the front cylnder was fireing on the top of the compression stroke.i finaly figured it out and used two sets of points,one for each cyl.,and two chevy350 coils.it ran good but was not fireing a the exact degrees apart.i ran it this way for awile.i was fustrated about it and wondered why didnt they build a duel point system
    where all the exact degrees between cyl.was figured out for us.by now i had poured my heart into this and was angry about all of it.so i bought a harley 1990 evo motor and fram and i had me a bike.
    oh by the way,i put a set of pete jackson grear
    drives on it.straight drag pipes.that thing sounded very loud[make a stock harley sound like a whimp]and after i built my harley i found out about dyna single fire[dual magnetic pickups and rotor which i think would have made my super-vee run perfect with the use of a degree wheel.
    i would like anyone who owns a supervee to contact me.i would like some help on ideas to get her goin again-thanx

  16. I am currently working on a Gen 2 Super Vee, but need a distributor. Anyone know where I could get one?

    Would love some help!

  17. Hello i have a Gen.1 Super Vee and it is running great. I fix all the problem with the engine by my self.
    Ole from Germany (Europe)

  18. Hello i also have a gen 1 Supervee the point cam was for a stock harley shovel head 45 Deg Motor, Not for a chevy 90 deg vee rear cyl would fire to soon causing backfire had to put a deg wheel on crank to get the proper grind on the points cam got it running sounds good also had to put a ultra starter on it at 230 lb i had a heck of a time just to thump over one cyl, also valve covers would fill up with oil no drains except for push rods witch is higher then valves, alittle smoke eh” drilled holes at botton of valve cover and in timing cover with hose for oil to drain out of the cover the last two number on the case is #18 an early one ,also you had to grind the trans both styles 4 speed fo fit with engine in hardtale frame . this engine is not for the average wrencher also found the only supervee drag bike the one made by nostalga is owned by a guy near chicago il. it is a gasser with hillborn injection real wild .bike. Twharley Momence IL usa

  19. TO Matt

    You will have to get an old chevy points dist, cut it down shorten it and interface it with a 1970 to 1978 harley shovelhead points cam and advance sys, just a suggestion, i never done it, but, it might work with the right machine shop ..

    Twharley

  20. My uncle has a genaration 3 and has worked out all the problems that came with it. I would like to find one my self, if anyone has any information on a gen 3 for sale let me know. Also if you need information let me know and i will hook you up with my uncle.

  21. Hello a Follow up on my supervee gen1 I found a custom made ignition Made by power-arc ,out of AnKenny Iowa, programmed for a 90 deg supervee motor not a 45 deg, harley. starts, runs good no backfire, kickback ,or broken bendix ,smooth on all power curves. they use optical sensors. with multiple spark, 360 deg programable and can be programmed up to a 8 Cyl V8. this ignition can be used on gen 1, 2, or gen 3 supervee’s Twharley.