The Kneeslider

Doers Builders and Positive People

The Possibilities of Limited Production Specials

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McDeeb Six Days - limited production niche motorcycle brands
McDeeb Six Days - limited production niche motorcycle brands

While off my feet for the last few days, definitely not by choice, I had some extra time to think instead of write. The McDeeb Royal Enfields kept coming back to me as a wonderful opportunity on many levels. A small dealer and builder putting out some very well designed specials based on a current production motorcycle is an idea that could be adapted by many similar companies, taking a motorcycle of their choice and doing something reflecting their own passion, in the way Fabrizio DiBella has turned his passion for old British motorcycles into the McDeeb lineup.

If the major manufacturers were willing to get on board, not trying to squeeze these innovators out, but encouraging them to take their products and build a true high quality special, more potential buyers might be found for the original models and perhaps, too, a new level of respect would arise for the potential innovative designs hidden in plain sight.

Many of you like the McDeeb style, recreating the past with these hand built beauties, some perhaps not, but a few were wondering about doing something similar with a Sportster and I would guess, a few of you had other bikes in mind as well.

Consider, also, the McDeeb specials are 500cc singles, not massive V-Twins or 180hp inline fours. Isn’t it refreshing to see someone devote time and attention to small displacement motorcycles enjoyable even without the skills of a Ben Spies?

There are already a lot of custom builders out there but these Royal Enfield derivatives are not designed to be one off builds to show how outrageous a custom can be, these are actually designed for limited production. You might, in the future, say you were buying a McDeeb and people would know what you were talking about, a rather nice scenario to my mind.

Basing the bikes on a current production model, ideally a somewhat higher production unit, ensures a ready supply of raw material, modifying an already limited production bike might leave you out of business quickly unless you could promptly retool for a different one.

Modifying a production model also eliminates the need for large investments that come with trying to start a new company from scratch. While I don’t think any of these niche brands would be high production, if approached properly, they might have some staying power, as long as the manufacturer didn’t try to cut off the small builder, “borrowing” his idea and taking it in house. It’s a synergistic, not competitive, relationship.

The skills are already out there, but builders concentrating on vintage bikes limit themselves to what’s available in the used market, instead of brand new bikes with lots of factory service and parts availability, certainly a more comforting situation for many customers.

Maybe I’m rambling here and this idea isn’t what I think it could be, but, on the other hand, maybe it’s not so crazy after all. What do all of you think and what other bikes would make a nice starting point for a new niche brand series of specials?

Comments

  1. I am shocked that nobody produces kits to make street legal 400cc ish ss bike. There’s a plenty of production street legal models which could be easily converted and finally bring a lightweight inexpensive 400cc looking sports bike. Every forum you go to, you will find people craving for those lightweight 50HP single cylinder machines. Yet nobody wants make a complete street legal kit. The chance that an OEM will come up with one is slim, because they want you to buy either mellow 250 ninja or 600cc ss bike with overkill power you cannot legally use ….

    I am not sure if I’d call it a special, but definitely a room for someone to step in and grab the market.

  3. I think that with such the huge supply of aftermarket parts which are available to customise most motorcycles, the demand for mild custom versions of current production bikes is well catered for. Unfortunately, low-volume specials built by small independent companies will always have such a price premium over a factory built bike that only a small group of enthusiasts will be willing to pay for them. Whilst the styling is a bit nicer, my rough calculations indicate that the McDeeb bikes range from more than double to just over triple the price of the base Royal Enfield. That’s the price of low-volume manufacturing. How many people are actually willing to put their money where their mouth is and pay triple the list price for individuality, when a couple of choice aftermarket parts like a set of bars, tank and seat will get you most of the way there for a fraction of the price?

    Also, @mxs, what about the Honda CB400 Super Four, or even a Suzuki GS500?

  4. Oh, just to add another bit of info to the debate of independent special vs factory ‘special’, taking again the McDeebs as an example. The Bullet G5 costs around US$6000 brand new, and the factory “Cafe Racer kit” costs an extra $2325, so we can assume that a dealer-fitted, factory Cafe Racer would cost about US$9000. The price range quoted in the McDeeb article works out to around US$14,500 to $20,750, not including shipping. I have to agree that the McDeeb looks much nicer, but is it $7000+ nicer?

  5. This is going on now, and has been for some time in the Street Tracker Sportster World. Both Storz and Mert Lawill market kits and complets bikes for street use. Omar and Phil Itlle racing both make and sell kits for Yamaha XS 650s and Sportsters of any vintage, including brand new. There is a company in England selling Cafe Racers based on Sportys. The market is turning away from “choppers”and inovative builders are moving to Cafe Racers, Flat Track clones and Board Track Clones.

  6. Any and all factory bikes can be used for series of specials. It’s just a matter of vision and talent.

  7. Or, you could build it yourself. The first poster wants a ~400cc sport bike. I can think of more than a few ways to do this. None of them very expensive. Go for it.

  8. A common thought or comment on this topic is: “Someone should just build a…or someone should just do this or that.” It takes a lot of time, money and brain space to develop these cool “Kits” so that the public can have some cool bolt-on stuff. The new generations of bike owners want these products at their disposal at what they consider to be a price that makes them happy. The “Doers” are meanwhile in their shops or garages or out on the carport making these things to modify their own bikes. I would think that McDeeb put a mountain of effort into these modified Royal Enfields to see if it could be done and done well. He has succeeded. Are they going to be expensive? Of course because the sales numbers will be low and the hours/effort will be high. He’s not a facotry. Royal Enfield has the factory. Could they get married up to the point where McDeeb is in the design center at RE (if they even have one)? Maybe, and I’d bet that Mc-D had that in mind at least at some level when he started these projects.

    Yes, I agree with Paul. The factory should have as many “Backdoor” shops or designers as they could gather up. Supply them with free bikes and/or funding and parts and see what they come up with. Maybe they’d discover a new X-75 out there among the Alcan fairings!

    For myself, I modify stuff and try to make bikes look and function better. Sometimes it works out really nice and other times, it’s a disaster.

    For McDeeb and the hundreds of other small custom build shops, you just hope that somebody notices your work or talents which leads to other, more profitable, and fun work.Will McDeeb get rich selling modified, restyled RE’s? I doubt it. But he sure as hell will get people’s attention with his work.

    As a builder, you keep plugging away at the bit roles, hoping that that one day you’ll get the roll that brings you an Oscar. Till then, you try to polish your craft.

  9. I’d be curious to see the British Sportster-based cafe racers. I also think, like some folks here, that smaller displacement, single cylinder bikes could do with a resurgence. They are not as powerful, which is a good thing for new riders who really have no business on a CBR or GSX, and they are immensely practical and (were) easy to work on. I think one of the most beautiful engines I have ever seen was the “ice cream cone-shaped” Ducati Diana. (Anyone remember those?) And I recall having a hell of a lot of fun on a Harley Italian-made Sprint. While I like what Storz has done with Sportys, street trackers have never been my cup of tea. As a young man, I remember lusting after a BSA Royal Star, and thinking that the BSA Lightning, with its chrome gas tank, was just about the most beautiful bike I’d ever seen. I recently saw one in a television commercial, where a good Samaritan just barely prevents a van from backing over one, and every time I see that same spot, even though I knew the bike will not be hit, I cringe. If I could afford it, and if I had the skills, I’d love to transform my 883L into something that echoed the spirit if the old BSAs and Norton Commando. (Maybe if I win the lottery.) Gas prices are going up again, and you can count on them going even higher as summer approaches and the oil companies start profiteering. A nice modern, low displacement single or twin (500cc or less) could be a logical vehicle to move up to from all those people buying scooters now. And the aging biker population could get a nice boost from entry-level newcomers if they could buy bikes they could afford.

  10. Hi guys,
    lot of arguments and only a few time to discuss about it but I like to reply to some questions. First of all we like to thank Paul Crowe for his generous appreciation ,and also the other persons who wrote comments about our specials.

    Our goal in developing Mcdeeb products is not to became rich. Thanks God, we live fine with our jobs: I have my own factory (CFM) and a well known motorcycle shop, while my partner Roberto is an appreciated financial consultant, but we love special motorcycles and like to share our passion with friends and customers…because sometimes they became both.
    Introducing the new McDeeb range we planned to offer brand new classic bikes, suitable for a wider purpose of true classic and a two years warranty like a modern vehicle, but maintaining a vintage look, sound and feeling and now we know we that also other people like the same instead of “plastic bikes”.
    An eventual interest from The Factory will be greatly appreciated: we have resources and strenght to concretize our dreams by ourself, but considering what we can do with an official support, we hope to receive it as an approval, to operate by appointment of the manufacturer as a R&D external branch for special bikes.

    Somebody talks about high prices of our specials but it need to explain that the pictured bikes are examples of the “top level” customizations we can make on each RE model, while lower steps of modification are possible and still nice. The Thruxton is the “extreme” version of a Bullet, while the Clubman is less expensive and the Clubman Superlight is cheaper : all depends on customers’ attitude and budget, and we usually offer also progressive steps.
    Now , our main job is to sale standard Bullets (in my opinion , “the proper bike for amazing trips with friends on the mountains and daily travel to work in a busy town, but not a jet to drive dangerously on public roads ) and we like to offer it both in standard trims as tailored at different levels of customizations on each customer needs.
    A car normally bring you from a place to another one, closed in a steel box, while a bike can make the same but giving you somethin more, too.
    The smell of the grass, the pleasure to be inside a landscape, with the wind on your face and the tupf-tumpf of its pipe. Why spend lot of money in a car that you probably will hate in the traffic when a bike can make it funny?
    Is a special bike expensive? It depend also by you own attitude: if you don’t use a car like me, a bike could be cheaper and make you free.

    Ciao
    Fabrizio

  12. Deus Ex Machina in Australia make really nice retro specials using Kawasaki W650s and also a few Triumphs and Harleys. I like the Evil Twin myself… Going back to the original question, I’m always amazed that small producers with imagination like Deus or MAC or Wrenchmonkees can produce really beautiful results while the big producers trot out fugly hunks of jaggy plastic every year and call it “a new model”.
    http://www.deus.com.au/

  13. Yes these McDeeb’s have a place. While not everyones cup of tea, there is aways a market if correctly done. Look at these and others mentioned here but I remember several I have seen over the years that should be put into production for road goers. Just also think of the Woods Rotax or the BMW Woods or the articles CW magazine had of the motocrossers turned road racers and how many of us would love to have a dirt bike that wasn’t 34″ tall and I really don’t need 7 feet of suspension. I had toyed with building street bikes from street legal dirt bikes, doing streettrackers syles, to sell as a business upon retireing but find myself far to busy on my own projects to do this. This only leaves room for others to get started. .

  14. There will always be a market for these type of unique style bikes,by using modern engines,electrics and running gear they are fun bikes and should be as reliable as the latest Japanese and European factory offerings. Even though the bikes of the sixties where nice looking, the relibility was atrotious. I had an early Bonneville and had to rebuild the major mechanics on a regular basis,as well as constant oil leak problems,electrical and fuel issues. In contrast, I recently toured Canada and parts of the USA on one of the new Bloor Triumph Bonnevilles,what a contrast.The new Bonnevillle is as nice a looking bike as its predecessor ,never leaked a drop of oil and was an absolute pleasure to ride and totaly reliable.In fact,the engine is just about bullit proof. If those retro looking Enfield engines used in the McDeeb’s are anywhere near the reliability of the new Bonneville they should be a very enjoyable bike.

  15. understand the concept, although I would love to see more of it, I’m just thinking a fairly large company may not take too kindly to some of the customisations done to their original design…nor would they want the attention drawn to the ‘improved’ customes created by another custome, opposed to what they have to offer….sounds good in theory, but don’t think will not work on a large scale, due to the brand image that needs to be protected and the bottom line sales that need to be made….
    …and by the way….don’t take it the wrong way, but the pictured bike does nothing for me, sorry…just not my cup of tea…or any other old British motorcycle for that matter, so I’m not really the best person to give thoughts on it….but do like the idea and passion behind the bike! wish you chaps all the best!!

  16. Good work McDeeb I am sure you will find many more buyers than detractors. I find your prices very reasonable for this level of craftsmanship.

  17. I can think of one example where factory support of a niche builder was not such a great idea in the long run (Buell).

    That said, I’ve always daydreamed with the idea of buying stripped chassis below dealer pricing and building my own specials and kits. I even have a decent basis for one sitting out in the garage right now (XR650L) but with a next-to-zero budget I won’t be building any special parts for it anytime soon. I did “motardize” it with CBR parts but I would much rather create a Cafe Racer kit for it and sell them by the truck loads (at least mini-truck loads).

    -todd

  18. Fabrizio!

    Please contact me. I have done some unique ideas I think you would enjoy and possibly build. I love your bikes – very well executed and retro-timeless!

    dayn@sevnone.org

  19. So what if you designed a cool little custom based on a production bike and then took your drawings to an existing contract manufacturer so the machines would actually be affordable? There are doers out there trying to figure out how to assure quality, meet regulations, import and distribute product right now. Most of them won’t make it, but some might and more power to those creative, hard working folks.

    http://www.clevelandcyclewerks.com/bikes/tha-misfit/

  20. Two questions, please:

    1) What particularly stands in the way of any dealer of any brand from buying his bikes at the usual dealer price and adding his own components as an “XYZ Custom Single (Brand)”?

    2) What happened to even basic skills of the average rider to find unusual parts and exert the minimal effort to create their own “custom” bike?

    In the first question, we’re not discussing the development and marketing work sucah as with Harley and Buell. No high profile race engine or slippery trick handling, just dealer/builder creations. Sure, to make any substantial number of units a significant investment in machinery and/or outsourcing would eventually become necessary, if the concepts were actually accepted by the buying public and not just given verbal accolades by talking heads. But it should be well within the financial capabilities of any builder/dealer with confidence in his/her work. The issue appears to be money, easy money. Let the factory take the risk and the dealer has only inventory to worry about.

    In issue two, the average rider/reader which includes far too many Brando wanna-be’s with a credit card, barely have enough actual skill to pilot the metal between their legs or take care of it. Every shop I visit has a service department filled with bikes waiting for oil changes. The bulk of riders don’t want to get their fingers dirty, let alone take the time to acquire any basic mechanical skills and the thought of doing any work to search out parts that might work…oh no no no! The mantra is “I want a custom” and not the slightest clue as to the meaning of the word custom. Any bike that is sold in multiple and identical appearance is no more of a custom than the brand bikes such as Kaws Vulcan Custom series or Yam’s V-Star Custom series, ad infinitum.

    The singular answer to the question “why hasn’t someone done this” is pretty simple. It’s not as profitable and it takes more time than just selling factory bikes. It ain’t easy, so why try. And following up, if they did do it it wouldn’t be a true custom so where is the buyer’s real incentive to pony up the bucks, i.e. how many wallets will open up for the extra price when the ego says ” I can piece that together after I get a stock bike”,
    even though the mind and soul lacks the follow-through to actually do it. Walter Mitty lives.

    The solution? Well, I believe that part of The Kneeslider’s mantra is to get involved and get done. So back to the future, rider and readers. Get together with your fellow enthusiasts and put together a club shop and buy some used equipment. Pick a few brains, spend some learning how to “do” things.

    Make it yours, a true custom. And be sure to send Paul the results.

    Gotta go eat some bugs on the interstate.

  21. In the guitar world ( my first love ) we use the term ‘ boutique ‘ quite often. While it doesn’t sound masculine as we’d like, it’s a great label to explain why we play a $4000 custom bass ( i.e. Conklin Guitars/Basses, Zinky Amps, and Keeley effects pedals ) and not something for $799 from Guitar Center; no pro would be caught dead playing something that cheap/cheese/fugly. The same could be said for the rider that has a little more taste, and his pocketbook isn’t afraid of expressing it. No, it isn’t for everyone, but then again neither is motorcycling. While my musical gear may be over the top, my bike is limited to a Milwaukee offering with a hint of performance and style added from the P&A catalog. (A near-stock bike is more expensive than my musical hobby : )

  22. Tom, sounds good in theory, but I believe very heavy internal politics keep the in-roads blocked to outsiders and all their silly creative ideas.

    S&S, the builder of engines and motor parts had a big competition where (I’m summarizing here as I don’t know all the exact details), gave out 50 complete motors to custom builders and the winner got a big prize. Every bike ended up being featured in magazines and every single bike had an S&S motor. So S&S got more exposure and good ideas than they could ever buy I would think.

    Now, imagine if Honda or Aprillia or Triumph, KTM, Yamaha or did that? They give out 20 bikes to builders and just tell them to go wild! Best designs, ideas or build gets a big prize. Harley doesn’t need to do this. They just have to look at all the magazines and they can see all the innovations performed on their products. Then they just take the stuff they like head back to the design department. “Here, do this!”

    Buell had a contest where you could design a paint scheme for a particular model and win something. I don’t know for sure what won, but I think it was some MTV, ghetto, grafitti theme that was very “Now” looking.

    If I had a big motorcycle company, I’d look for all the ideas I could get knowing that they come from all kinds of strange places. Not just from motorcycle riders.

  23. In the past a bunch of small companies have actually used Yamaha engines in small runs so it isn’t out of the question.

  24. These bikes are timeless classics harking back to what is best about the history of motorcycling. These bikes promote the mechanical simplicity beauty and material qualities of the air cooled masterpieces. That brings me to the only choice for a new series Moto Guzzi! Well there’s also some beautiful Laverda’s and Z1’s out there from the 70’s! Your a wealthy man or men in terms of character we can see it your work!

  25. Love the McDeebs. Particularly the Six Days and Super Light. I currently own a KLR650 and an 06 Speed Triple. The ST is dead sexy and outperforms the KLR by a REALLY big margin–and yet I still have a lot of fun with the KLR…often more than the ST because I can actually use all of the performance it packs on the street without worrying about getting pulled over or punting myself over a guard rail.

  26. funny thing about the internet, is that if you spend five minutes googling your “original” idea, you find that someone else has already done it. case in point: i’ve been thinking about buying an 85-100cc dirtbike from Craigslist (which in these rough times people are practically giving away around here in baltimore county) and rebuild it as a superlight streetbike–something with more pep and respect than the $999 chinese scooter or a dinky Tomos. but i take my daily visit to The Kneeslider and i find that someone (Tom from Cleveland CycleWerks) already makes the bike i want. in fact, plenty of people already make the bike(s) i want. but dealers in my area can’t be bothered to carry them. and they’re the ones with the real power, and the investment capital. it’s a shame they’re so stubborn in their ways.

  27. The Cleveland CycleWerks Heist model with a RE engine would be very reminiscent of a BSA powered bike I pieced together as a kid from whatever I could beg,borrow or buy for little of nothing. I was very proud of that bike and even though it had four colors of paint and a lot’s of rust. It was well received and envied by those that didn’t have wheels. I’ve lived long enough to see them come around again. Quite worrying about posing and build something.

  28. @Jay Allen

    What a hoot! You have no concept of a limited production or a custom machine.

    I’ve seen guys like Joe Walsh switch off from one his own axes mid-concert to stock Fender Strat. I’ve watched Eric Clapton go unplugged with a Yamaha FG. I’ve seen Slash rip-up a private party on a black face Les Paul.

    The reasons these guys have other specialty guitars is because they have risen to the top of the pack and can afford to own something truly over the top. New, not second hand, and not a strain on the pocket book. And because they have musical talent, not guitar building talent (Walsh excepted).

    The idea of a custom or limited production bike is similar, but not the same. For that real steel between the kneebones to be worthy of the price or the label, it needs to be unique. Not just because Valentino Rossi rides one, or not because Tom Cruise has one, and not because Arnold Schwarzenegger was seen on one.

    It should appeal to the individual for all the right reasons.

    And it should be unique, at least in some large or small way either blatant or subtle, from every other bike on the road. Whether you fit a set of clip-ons to a V-Max and paint the frame blue or mount a Tohatsu tank on a Sporster, it should say “this is the way I ride and I don’t care what you think”.

    Regardless of your wallet size, if you own the truly biking gene you’ve got to get it personal. If you’re just a rider, I get it, that’s okay.

    Just don’t be confused with who and what you are.

  29. @ PeteP

    Not that easy and within everyone’s reach. It has to be based on currently licensed motorcycle (otherwise no chance to get it licensed for street where I live …), hence someone who makes kind of bolt on kits. One cylinder 400cc bike like DRZ400SM with some fairing etc would be awesome street legal bike. 40HP easy within reach (or more …) at 300ish pounds wet weight ….