The Kneeslider

Doers Builders and Positive People

Is a Good Enough Motorcycle Good Enough?

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An interesting article in Wired magazine about the “good enough” revolution got me thinking. Products with fewer features and less than top shelf performance combined with lower price can become very successful because they do everything the majority of the market wants or needs. My weekend was a good example.

Over the last few days, I was at a family wedding out of town. As noted before, I now use an Acer netbook computer to stay connected while on the road, a little machine that does everything I need for a day or two (or longer in emergencies) without the need to cart around a much bigger laptop, … it’s definitely good enough. While sitting in the front row at the church, I made a video of the wedding on a Flip MinoHD, an amazing little video camera that has few whiz bang features but slips into your pocket and records 60 minutes of HD video. It’s not a professional camera, but then, I’m not shooting professional videos, … it’s good enough. It’s good enough because it does a few things really well, without trying to do everything just OK.

what consumers want from the products and services they buy is fundamentally changing. We now favor flexibility over high fidelity, convenience over features, quick and dirty over slow and polished. Having it here and now is more important than having it perfect. These changes run so deep and wide, they’re actually altering what we mean when we describe a product as “high-quality.”

Take that idea a bit further and think about motorcycles. How much motorcycle do you need to get enough performance, enough of the time to say it’s good enough? Forget the ABS, GPS, cruise control, paddle shift, traction control, variable valve timing, and instead how about a nice bike with all of the basics done really well? Can a manufacturer be brave enough to say, “No, this bike doesn’t do any of that, but it’s a great basic bike.”

If you can’t afford the perfect motorcycle, however you may define it, think about what you really need. How do you ride? How far, how fast, how often, solo or 2 up and then see what is out there to do the job. Is the biggest, fastest, high end machine maybe too much?

How well does this idea apply to the motorcycle market? How much motorcycle do you really want or need? What is good enough?

Posted on Filed Under: Motorcycle Builders, Motorcycle Business

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Comments

  2. Honda Nighthawk, Hawk, F3, F4, and more. Suzuki Bandit, SV 650, Yamaha FZR 600. They all make these bikes.
    Where I’m at here in Mexico about 3/4 of the bikes sold are less than 200 cc, proving this concept beyond a doubt.
    Al you made me giggle with your comment….
    Thure

  3. Hi there. I used to have a GL1800, with most of the factory options. My main bike now, is a Suzuki Bandit 1250, with factory hard bags. I think it is a much better all around motorcycle. And a lot less money. Blaine

  4. Most people can’t even approach the limits of 20 year old superbikes, other than doing something stupid and highsiding their asses over the nearest wall.
    Motorcycle design has been incremental over the last decade. There isn’t a huge amount that a brand new bike can do that its predecessors can’t.
    I have never used any of the technologies that you mentioned above Paul, so I can’t claim that I don’t need them, but so far I’ve lived without and plan on doing so for a good while yet.

  5. There is a utility aspect (means of transportation) that can be satisfied very easily by the barebones motorcycle. Then there is the sensory experience, functioning at a higher level on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs pyramid that may be met by the bells and whistles for some…

  6. I just purchased a vespa gts 300 and it is a lot easier to ride in day to day urban/suburban stop and go traffic. Twist and go. It still beats most cars off the line and no 1-2 2-1 constant shifting. Once I get a top case for it it will be even more useful. My motorcycle still gives me the thrills. A M109. Opening it up just gives that thunderous exhaust note and the oceans of torque throws you back. Puts a grin on my face every time.

  7. This is why I continue to ride my Yamaha Majesty every day. Yes, the H-D engineers I work with every day poke fun of the fact that I ride a “scooter”. Sure, I’d like a BMW F800 GS. Ultimately, I have a hard time justifying the added expense to simply go from home, to work, to home.

  8. I guess it all depends on the use you make from your bike.

    If you just commute, a simple decent mid-size such as Bandit/Nighthawk is more than good enough, it even can make you happy on the twisties in the weekend.
    If you want to tickle the chrono, then of course you’ll look for the last “one pound less / one hp more” product that appears in the showroom every year or so.
    If you want to show off, you get to the same showroom because you can’t stand to have the exhaust under the seat anymore, it has to be a short cone on the side now, even if 2 years ago the exhaust under the seat was ridiculizing the good old carbon muffler on the side … or you get a Harley, if you’re more on the cruiser side.

    Agree with Kenny, a 20 years old bike is in most cases way beyond the average riders skills (me included), so much for the latest MotoGP-derivative product.

    Now, products need to improve, and it’s good to have bubbas buying every generation of new Gixxers, it keeps the manufacturers on their toes and developp exciting new products.

  9. I bought my Guzzi 1000SP new in the spring of 1983. I still ride it today, and I can’t recall ever riding it without a big grin coming across my face. It does everything I have, and will ever need a motorcycle to do. I’ve ridden a lot of makes and models and some were so smooth they were like riding a refrigerator with handlebars, but that’s not what I ever wanted in a motorcycle. $15,000 for a new motorcycle, I just don’t think so. If BMW brought back the R75/5 Toaster with electronic engine management, modern brakes, and a sticker of $7,500, they would likely sell a billion of them. Heck, just look at Enfield Bullet sales.

  10. Honda Nighthawk i think is a perfect example of a “good enough” bike, as it does damn near everything that way. Also the modern Triumph Bonnevilles

  11. All of this would be true if motorcycles where just means of transportation. But they are big toys and I like my toys to go really fast.

  12. I don’t think there is any bike out there that does just the basics well. Here’s what I look for. My riding preference is standard seating (sport tourer style) and I ride fairly spirited.
    1. A quality adjustable suspension that is set up and customized for my weight and street riding.
    2. A seat that is not a torture device.
    3. An low maintenance engine (valves) like the Yamaha FZ6’s 26,000 mile interval.
    4. Linear power delivery and reaches 60 mph in less than 4 seconds.
    5. at least a 200 mile range.
    6. less than 400 lbs (easy to move around the garage during the winter months)
    5. Heated hand grips. An absolute must as I’m not a fair weather rider.
    6. Silky smooth transmission. (OK now I’m getting picky)
    7. Naked
    8. Standard lockable and removable hard side cases without the ugly framework that is usually exposed when the cases are removed

  13. Just enough to get me where I’m going? Light and cheap? I own and ride several of them – they are called “bicycles”.

    Anything more than that needs to thoroughly captivate MY attention.

  14. There have been three new motorsports (bikes, scoots and quads) dealerships opened within 50 miles of my house in the past three years. Amazingly, they’re all single brand dealers – the same brand. Even in the tough 2009 business climate, they seem to be doing okay – I haven’t seen their books or anything, but they’ve got good showroom traffic and they’re turning inventory. The brand? American Lifan.

    Good enough?

  15. Other than the rotten tyres and brakes, a BSA B31 would still make a good day-to-day runner, especially if fitted with saddlebags and rear rack. I would like to try an new Royal Enfield; it may be the answer.

  16. My ’73 R75/5 does everything well without any complaints. It even has more power than I ever really, handles great, and stops quickly. Sure, it’s got extra useless stuff, like stainless tank panels (it’s a Toaster) that serve no function and it could probably go down to one muffler instead of the two – it could do without the extra cylinder too. The only improvement I’ve made is a battery connection for my electric gloves.

    I have other bikes that serve other purposes but this is the bike that has reliably put on 100,000 miles for me and I’ve never adjusted the chain…

    -todd

  17. I’m talking about street riding here- not dedicated racing….but even where people want a sporting ride, i noticed something interesting in a couple of recent issues of Cycle World. Several liter class superbikes were reviewed and most did 0-60 in 3.2-3.4 seconds. The Suzuki Gladius and Kawasaki ER-6n do it in 3.4-3.6 with about 350 less ccs. Both “standard” bikes also handle very well when pushed, don’t punish you when you are just going from point A to point B and cost around $6,500. is good enough, good enough? Good enough is darned good!

  18. I use to have 2 motorcycles… one with ABS/AFI/ESP/ATS/ERP/etc (14.579€)
    one with one carb, one cylinder, one front disc, one seat, one “everything” (build it mostly myself for less than 3.000€)
    The single cylinder one is the funiest, even if I can’t go over 140km/h with it.

  19. This is true in all facets of life,not just Motorcycles. I want a cell phone that just makes and receives calls,with Big buttons. I want a Car that has a Radio with simple controls, No owners manual to set the clock. Is it a shock that I ride a Harley? It takes me where I want to go, everyday ,and will probably outlast Me!!

  20. I own 15 motorcycles and scooters (including a new Yamaha Zuma and a restored 62 Super Eagle Scooter) including an MH 900 e (#1599). 2 years ago I purchased a Triumph Bonneville Black and a Scrambler. Both bikes do everything I want to do and then some. Fantastic quality for the money and they look cool. Both new cost less than my ’99 FXR2 when it was new. Both are so simple to work on and modify.

  21. I believe the Buell (ahem) Blast is a perfect example of the good enough motorcycle. Even though Erik Buell himself may remove his “Buell” stickers from the tanks, I gladly ride mine whether it’s commuting, the twisty backroads, or the long weekend vacation. It does everything I need good enough.

  22. I think that something easy to maintain is a good idea. Simple stuff like a center stand, and a manual that contains how to take care of the basics like an oil chance, bleeding the brakes, etc. I think the hardest part about owning a motorcycle is getting it to and from the shop.

    I agree that a long interval on valve adjustments is a good idea.

  23. The problem with the good-enough motorcycle is that the people who want them keep them a long time instead of chasing after the latest, hottest, most gizmo-laden thing every couple of years, so the sales volume will always be low.

  24. This is an interesting topic because it depends on parts of the motorcycle for me. It probably will catch everyone in a contradiction: e.g. what if everyone said in 1940, “yep, that bike is good enough” ?
    ——-
    The V11 Guzzi motor is good enough for me (street riding), but I want lighter shaft-driven wheels to further enjoy that motor. In regards to the folks that say a 20 year old bike can still out-perform most riders’ skill (true), but I’ll take the last 20 yrs of metallurgy, brake, & suspension development to raise my “good enough” bar.

    “good enough” is a moving target, but the average bike in any given era has loads of merit.

  25. Ducati Monster 650 without the desmo, with standard forks, wire wheels and sensible gas tank and handlebars.
    I’ll buy a new one tomorrow, and keep it for [ever].

  26. I’m looking in to getting a Suzuki V-Strom 650 for just this reason. Or a previous-year SV650…basically what Bob N said above.

  27. I just picked up a 1987 Yamaha Radian that needed the carbs cleaned and a new rear tire. I traded a laptop repair for it and LOVE IT!! I think it is the perfect good enough bike.

  28. I agree with the sentiment, but please let me keep my ABS. I just really like it on a bike.

  29. Part of the “good enough” thing is that technology has actually gotten to the point where it is good enough. You can get hi-fi quality sound out of cheap-as-hell speakers now, and the marginal difference between those and really expensive ones isn’t that much.

    And despite the fact that “old bikes did it all” — well, maybe. But good brakes, a decent suspension, reliability, brighter lights… “good enough” for me would be my old ’00 SV650, but with fuel injection and ABS. Although, given traffic around here, I could get away with a moped. (If you never get above 20mph, you’ll never know the difference!)

  30. Agree with “Al 08.31.09 at 11:42 am Harley-Davidson has proved this principle over and over and over and over…”
    By the looks of it, HD pretty much put the majority of their research dollars into marketing etc, and release the same thing every year with slight changes…not rocket science, but a tried and proven technique by creating a type of heritage brand…give people just enough of what they need, with spin. Get enough people ‘hooked’ and you’ve got loyaltly base that would give up a kidney for a new ride…sure there are better, more economic to run, cheaper bikes/cruisers…but HD has just the right amount of raw steel and engine for my liking!
    Yes by the way i own a HD…and i love it!

  31. I think there will always be a range of what people are looking for.

    Anyway, I’d like to nominate my ’88 Kawasaki Concours as good enough. It could be better, but it’s not, and it was cheap. 1000cc, nice fairing, bags are big enough for a jacket and raingear on one side, lunch box and thermos on the other.

    But I disagree on the cheap speakers, they suck!

    Good enough is whatever you can afford, or willing to spend.

  32. My just good enough bike ia my 84 Honda CB700SC Nighthawk; shaftdrive, hydraulic valves never need adjusting, hydraulic clutch eliminates cables, dual front disc brakes. This is a bike for the daily commute or the cross-country trip. Maintenance is gas, oil/filter and tires. This is the Honda bike that is as close to their Civic car as any bike of the era (but the NH is a lot more fun to ride than an 80’s Civic ever was to drive). Great standard seating position, decent gas mileage with a too small tank, but hey she’s almost perfect for what I need and how I ride.

  33. My 06 Suzuki sv650 is all the bike I need. With the forks and shock off a 05 gsxr 750 it will corner like a rat in a drain pipe or cruise like a Harley. The best of both worlds.

  34. I’ve always had “functional” motorcycles, absent of all the frills. That said, I love my cruise control, great stereo including XM radio, bags, and couch comfortable seat on my ’07 Harley Road Glide, and wouldn’t think of going back to the stone ages. Just my opinion. To each his own.

  35. I think a strong indicator of this mentality is the huge growth in scooter sales. Since the earliest ones, it’s always been about utility on 2 wheels. I remember hearing about the study where it would take $6 per gallon or more before most Americans would hop on a bike for fuel economy. So I’m pretty sure “good mileage” is a convenient excuse to have a little fun with a small bike you can ride to work everyday and that is easy for a new rider to handle.

  36. Just good enough… I’ve employed this logic lots of times. Four years ago I was ready to reward myself for making a few extra $$ on a construction project. At the Candy Store (AKA Ducati Austin) I was debating the merits of a new Multistrada. Style, exclusivity, price… I settled on the “just good enough” MTS620 (red, naturally) for 8K vs the MTS1000 for 4K more. It’s the perfect commuter for me and my short 10 mile daily ride. Could I have settled for less? Yes, but it’s all about finding that “balance” in life, isn’t it?

  37. Thanks to a bout of unemployment due to the meltdown of broadcast media last winter, I was forced to sell my Ducati ST4S. Luckily, I was able to keep my old 1996 900SS/SP, and this year it was my touring mount instead. I found that besides the lack of a fuel gauge, there really wasn’t anything that the ST4S could do that the 900SS can’t.

    I can get on it and ride for 500 miles without a problem, I can tour on it for multiple days, and it’s a ton of fun on twisty roads. It’s not the “best” at anything, but it does everything well…and it looks stunning.

  38. I always had fun on tiddlers…….find the tooling for 60’s Honda Superhawks and we’re done.

  39. How much is enough? Finding what “enough” means to you is the key to happiness. Both my ’97 Ducati Monster 750 and my ’04 Suzuki V-Strom 650 are “enough” bike to keep me very happy and spending most of my free time riding. I use to dream of owning some exotic superbike, but when I really think about it, would I be any happier, or enjoy the ride any more? Doubtful.

    If somebody gave me a fully loaded BMW K1300GT tomorrow, I am sure that I would love riding her and be happy………..but I wouldn’t be MORE happy.

    Good stuff, love this site. Cheers.

  40. “Good enough” is only possible due to technology and manufacturing advances being able to deliver Vincent Black Lightning performance specs (380 LBS, 70HP, 150MPH), in a cheap affordable package (i.e. a SV650, a Ducati Monster 620, etc). In other words, what many now consider “good enough” was setting world land speed records on the Bonneville Salt Flats a mere 60 years ago.

    “Good enough” is both needs and personality driven — after all motorcycle purchases are more driven by aesthetics and aspirations than most other consumer goods. For amateur racers and wannabe racers, “good enough” is probably going to look like a Gixxer, R1 or CBR. For the marque obsessives, it will be a low end or older Harley, Ducati, or BMW. For aging boomers who have just discovered their inner outlaw biker, only a big expensive Harley or custom chopper will suffice.

    For me, a Honda V-twin in the 600cc range weighing in at about 450 LBS is about perfect — heavy enough for the freeway, light enough for in-town, powerful enough to be fun but not going to get me in trouble or tempt me to idiocy — every bike I have owned that was bigger or smaller has been either too much or too little. My old ’88 Honda Hawk NT605 GT was a “good enough” bike for me for a long while (once a removed the stock nightmare and put on a Corbin solo seat, modern tires and tweaked the engine). My current ’05 Shadow VLX 600CD is similarly such a bike (or will be when I finish tweaking the engine and pulling off all the unnecessary pieces). Both have great fit and finish, overall integration of components, Honda reliability, and look good enough that I’m not parking them on side streets.

    The best part is that many of the best “good enough” bikes are readily available on the used market in great shape with low miles for less than $3k — even your Harley Sportsters and Ducati Monsters can be found for less than $4k if you look.

  41. The most important thing is not what you ride, but how. A friend of mine raced 600s at Summit Point and would regularly smoke the squids in the twisties while riding his Honda Shadow.

    I’ve always thought that we were at the “polishing a turd” stage for internal combustion engines with variable-timing valves, butterfly valves in the exhaust, and the other technical arrogance applied to motorcycles.

    For me, a “good enough” motorcycle has a comfortable (but slightly sporting) seating position that I can do thousand-mile days on, if I had to, light weight (around 500 lbs, or less), wind protection (or the option of adding aftermarket protection), the ability to add aftermarket storage, and ABS.

    My ’99 BMW R1100S, after a few mods, does all of this. My wife’s Buell Blast comes pretty close, too, but is just too small for me. If only the Buell Ulysses had ABS…

  42. I think this discussion is really about the way the manufacturers have forgotten the standard motorbike – the Japanese UJM fours or the earlier British vertical twins and singles being examples of what’s been lost. Now the bikemakers have split the market into pseudo racers, clunky pseudo Harley cruisers and fake offroaders, and so people who want a general purpose motorbike struggle to find it. There are some excellent exceptions, but not many. What makes a general purpose motorbike? A seating position that’s ok around town or on the open road, a long enough wheel base that the bike can have a proper dual seat, a tractable engine. None of this is rocket science. Any bike factory could provide it. Their marketting people seem mad.

  43. The real power in this concept comes when you start talking about paradigm-shifts. Think about a motorcycle that is good-enough under the old paradigm’s measurements, but offers new capabilities — a new type of fun. Let me offer a few illustrations.
    1. In the late 90’s Buell came out with the S1 White Lightning. It was basically the standard S1 Lightning with a narrower handlebar, a wider fuel tank, and about 10 more horsepower. I remember riding the White Lightning and noticing that, dispite the extra horsepower, the riding experience was missing a piece of the fun offered by the standard Lightning.

    2. Years ago, I noticed, via the internet, that riders in England who were switching from sport bikes to Supermotos were stating that they were switching because supermotos were “more fun on the street.”

    3. I periodically run into riders who claim that their Kawasaki KLR 650, or some similar bike is the most fun bike they own and that it is the one that gets ridden the most. Interestingly, the commenter never talks about riding the dual-sport in the dirt. He almost always launches into a comment about leaving his friends on sport bikes for dead on a mountain road.

    If you want to understand this dynamic and its incredible power, read “The Innovator’s Dilemma; When New Technologies Cause Great Firms to Fail,” writen by Clayton M. Christensen and published by Harvard Business School Press. Does this apply to the motorcycle industry? Absolutely!!! I have been preaching for years that a new paradigm based more on control than “performance” is migrating from the dirt-bike market to the street bike market.

    This new paradigm provides a new type of fun and will attract new riders to the sport. At the same time, it will undermine the current paradigm and cause its collapse — catching most manufacturers unaware and unprepared. Until recently, KTM was leading the development of this new paradigm. If done right, leading the development of this new paradigm will endow a new company with the position of market leader in a changed and expanded market. This is the mechanism by which Honda gained its former market leadership position.

  44. Spot on! Do not need anything from iRobot.

    Well that is the reason the old timer royal enfield (CI) sells! It’s got a great sound, awesome range, comfy seat, good grip and drivable all round the year. i can use it as a commuter or tourer but not a racer without substantial mods. Riding it is like going into the trance of those endless thumping notes keeping you company for the road. Its go no over the top features decently priced and good!!

  45. In my country, which manufacturers only produce <250cc legal bikes, i pick a GOOD ENOUGH 1982 100cc, 1 cyl GL-100 Honda for commuting (40kilometers per trip daily) and have more fun than when i ride a brand new Honda (the company who owns the Honda license now is suck!).
    With only $250 to buy the bike, 50 kilometers per liter and 60Kph top speed. I enjoy the scene which i probably missed if i ride faster. Not to mention 4000 km/oil replacement and a very durable bike.
    Once i ride 50 kilometer until i brought it to a service center with piston ring split into 3 pieces and oil filter jammed which resulting a broken camshaft and damaged intake port. YES it still working and humming happily!

  46. This is a smoke screen for I can’t afford anything better!

    There has always been a quest for the perfect motorcycle, and this is just the latest incarnation of that quest. I ride a VFR750 from 1991. It is good enough – but it isn’t what I would be riding if I had the money for anything better!!

    There is also the idea that good enough is what was around when you were younger. A 90’s bike is good enough for me, because I always wanted a new one. A 70’s bike is just too old, big, heavy and cumbersome. It also leads to another problem – the two bike scenario. Its where you have the good enough bike for certain situations, but end up on the wrong bike at the wrong time!

    Once we are past this recession, we will still have this discussion but it will resume as the perfect motorcycle thread!

  47. this is something the major motorcycle editorials overlook in their quest to compare the Japanese bikes to their more expensive European counterparts. For example, Cycle World wrote a literbike comparison between the four Japanese models, the Ducati 1198S, KTM RC8R, and the Aprilia RSV4. How can these Euro bikes even compare to the performance offered by japanese bikes when they cost so much more? The authors then try to explain their reasoning for favoring the european bikes as an ’emotional appeal.’ As if the appeal of a much cheaper sportbike can’t influence your decision making? No bike is perfect, it’s something you must invest time and more money; in that case, why not start off with a well equipped Suzuki, Yamaha, Honda, or Kawasaki?

  48. Well I must say I’m not much of a motorcycle guru, when it comes to the newer tech stuff. I have an 03 883 Sporty, and would not trade it for anything else ever. Simplicity is the key for me I guess and being in the 50 ish age group riding is only a hobby not a commute or grand tour anymore. The perfect motorcycle is and always will be a preference for the rider. When I started riding in the early 70’s It was all about cheap transport and if you could fix it without taking it to a shop even better. The idea was it cost big dollars to drive a car and the fun factor was just not there, the motorcycle was the answer for alot of people who had a little bit of the adventure side kicking in. The sporty is a long time, long running, dependable bike, if and I do mean “IF” you keep up the maintenance, the same rings true about anything mechanical. Alot of the newer bikes are to the point that the auto has gotten to, you open the hood have a look inside and need a super computer just to adjust your fuel flow. I think that besides having a bad habit of changing up stuff I own to be more user friendly, (for my use), The perfect motorcycle would be one you don’t have to wrench on and just change the oil and ride, maybe the new electric ones will reach that goal??
    RATS

  49. I’m from Chicago and grew up in the Do-It-Yourself alternative music culture and I believe that “good enough” is almost always superior to top of the line.

    The best motorcycle I’ve ever owned is a 1977 Vespa P200E. It’s simple, fast, can carry two passengers very comfortably, is stylish, reliable and also hauls groceries & gear like a pack animal. I still own this bike. This bike is a classic and, having bought this bike for $700, it is worth more now then when I purchased it.

    I own a few other bikes (Ducati 900 SS, Cagiva Mito 125, KLR 650, Honda VTR 250). While all of these bikes make me happy and are mostly simple, none of them bring the pure visceral and experiential delight that the Vespa brings.

    Simple is better.

    (Now, if we can only get Cagiva to make the 500cc, 4-stroke single Mito, I can die a happy man…)

    Timble

  50. I ride a 600 Honda Shadow, with a windshield, sissybar, luggage rack, an aftermarket case for my GPS and soft bags. The only things I would change are the lack of highway bars and lack of a fifth gear. She’s my daily ride on my 25 mile commute.

  51. of course a good enough motorcycle is good enough. but what’s good enough for me may not be good enough for you. everyone has different purposes for riding and enough people are riding that motor companies can tailor suit a bike to your needs better now than they used to.

    go back to 1975 when honda came out with the GL1000. it looked just like a CB750 just with a different engine. people started throwing big seats on it, hard luggage, and front fairings. so honda evolved it into the Goldwing and now it comes with those things standard. if you wanted something sportier you had the CB line which sooner or later got the ‘R’ tacked on and became there sport bike. i’m loosely generalizing here so please don’t nit pick me to much. the gist of what i’m getting at is that people refined there taste for what they wanted out of their bikes and the dealerships gave people what they wanted.

    but in doing so they made it harder to find a bike that could do a little bit of everything like the older bikes used to. a CB750 was peppy enough to go have fun on yet comfortable enough to take a passenger on a nice long scenic ride. now if you want to do both you either need to have both bikes or get one that works for the type of riding you do most often and have it ‘make do’ when you do the other.

    my previous bike was a buell XB9R and was a blast for short jaunts and curvy roads but left me a bit sore after longer rides. so i got a HD sportster which is more comfortable for the longer rides but now i miss the peppy sportbike i had. where is my middle ground? i can only afford one bike. i only have room to store one bike. what bike will let me carve corners yet also do a 3 day trip and feel comfortable? this has been my quandry for the whole summer. power is of little importance to me as long as it can comfortably to highway speeds.

  53. Very interesting and daring what you suggest. As a motorcycle riding instructor, it seems that 80% of the people I train already know the exact bike they want. As a 30+ year veteran of riding I understand that for most people a bike is an emotion driven thing, (ie: not a practicality). So they seem to pick the bike they want based on that emotion. I partially blame the marketers for creating an abstract sense of romanticism about what riding is about just to sell a particular style of bike.

    It will take years, if not decades for riders (If they ride that long) to understand what different bikes do and what THEY want their bike to do.

    Personally of the 15 bikes I have owned, some of the more fun ones to ride were the least technologically advanced ( Yami SR500, GL1000 [naked], Kawi ZX6r [naked]).

    Just ask yourself what do you want your bike to do?

  54. As with every other portion of life.. when good enough becomes the standard, the standard drops.

    The idea of a purely adequate bike sounds like a government project, and I’ll pass.

  55. I own 8 bikes any where from sport bikes to chopper and anything in between. The best bike out of the group, KLR650. Cheap, easy to work on, take gravel roads at 70 mph, immune to potholes and I can take it though the woods on the way home from work(I do). Perfect example, a few weeks ago I was in the Smokies riding 2up took a fire road for 10 miles doing creek crossings and let out on the Dragons Tail. Good enough, I THINK SO.

  56. In some 40 years of riding motorcycles, I’ve thrown a leg over just about every type of bike there is, except for full-on factory racers, which would be not only well beyond my budget, but beyond my skills, as well. What Nicky Hayden does with a motorcycle defies the laws of physics, as far as I’m concerned, and I’m never likely to come anywhere close to that kind of riding. Having said that, I consider myself an experienced and aggressive street rider. I’ve toured, ridden dirt, and canyon raced. Now, I just commute, using my bikes alternately as my daily transportation. My rides? An ’06 Harley 883L and ’09 FXD. I like both for different reasons, but my mind keeps going back to my insurance bill. The FXD costs twice as much to insure as my Sportster. Does it give me twice the fun and the utility? Not really. Do I really need the fuel injection of the FXD when my Sporty carb, except for some occasional chuffing, has never let me down? The FXD is faster, but going much faster than 70 is begging for a ticket, and I’ve got a clean license for the first time in years and would kind of like to keep it that way. The Sporty also gets better gas mileage. Hmmm….maybe if I sent the cylinders off to NRHS for a bore and piston job, I could get a 1200 that I could insure for the price of an 883…. The only thing I need to ask myself is, do I really NEED a 1200?

  57. Where I live a bike that is good enough must be able to handle potholes and gravel roads, have good gas mileage and be faster than 75 mph…If you need a better seat, heated grips, a sound system or whatever, just buy it from your local aftermarket parts shop.

    Recently I changed the seat on my motorbike and I know it will be good for another 1,000 miles.

  58. A “boomer” pulled up beside me at a traffic light on a stretched fat-ass custom the other day. I could tell by the big toothy grin he was sport’n that a KLR 650 wouldn’t cut it for him. I guess its all relative…for now.

    I am concerned that American Lifan dealers are popping up like dollar stores while countries like India are using tarrifs to increase the existing trade slope in thier own favor. These low-cost, high-value scooters and cycles will stress the mainstream manufacturers / dealer base and probably challange their viability. Ultimately, we could be left with fewer product options – all of a lower calibre.

  59. Halfway through my first tour in Iraq, I bought a brand new ’05 SV650S. Between then and this July, I spent nearly half of my time in Iraq and still managed to put more than 24,000 miles on that motorcycle. I rode it from Fort Benning, GA to Louisville, KY to Houston, TX and back to Fort Benning. I rode it from Houston, TX to Las Vegas, NV and back the twisty way. There’s not much of anywhere I needed, or wanted, to go that I couldn’t get to on the SV. It was, by all means, good enough.

    At some point, the wear and tear life as an Infantryman put on my body changed the definition of good enough. The riding position aggravated my back such that even the thought of riding was painful. I sought out something with a more upright position, factory hard luggage (I added hard cases to the SV), a better windscreen, longer range, and shaft drive. Now I ride an FJR1300A. I get the same fuel economy I got on the SV, twice the power, better suspension, and no chain to worry about. The seats are more comfortable. It is definitely good enough.

    As someone pointed out earlier, good enough is a moving target. That target is different for us all.

  60. i don’t think American Lifan is any sort of challenge for mainstream bikes YET. the largest size engine they offer is a 400cc and it’s in a cruiser style bike. if you want sporty you have to get a 200cc. i’m not saying that that is bad. but most people want larger engines. it’s also far to easy right now to search the internet and find stories of how hard it is to get parts and how easy it is for the bikes to break. i bet that will improve though.

    eventually it will force the other motorcycle companies to offer something comparable. kawasaki already has the ninja 250 and maybe pressure from companies like this is what made them finally give it a makeover. there will still be the bigger bikes with all there bells and whistles as long as people still buy them.

  62. Candidates: Suzuki SV650, or GS500 plenty enough, reliable, mature. Now if Kawasaki would just bring back the W650 for classic looks it would be a success ill bet..

  63. Forgot the Suzuki DR650 and DRZ400SM also excellent value candidates that are good enough. (Notice a trend, Suzuki has been on to this notion for quite some time)

  64. My “good enough” bikes… ’72 Bonneville and & ’74 Honda CB360. Add in a ’95 Triumph Thunderbird while you’re at it. All could be described as frill free… nothing but a seat, wheels & a motor. Being currently unemployed, 40-60mpg is important to me & I do ride the bikes to save gas money. What bothers me about my sole modern bike (Thunderbird) is that it’s a little too “good enough”. It would benefit from the same fully adjustable suspension included on most other Triumphs of that era, but girl on the back & a picnic basket… I could ask for nothing else from it. As for limited range, 100mi & I’m usually ready for a quick break, have a smoke and reflect on the past couple hours on the road.

  65. I bought a 03 Suzuki Volusia 800 and have outdone everybody else in the past six years. At $6000, and paid for, 52-65 MPG, I love it…maintenance is extremely low, one tire and a little minor adjustment…I don’t have all the bells and whistles, just a great cruising ride…..love it….

  66. My perfect bike? Well, for my everyday use, a mid to large (400-650cc) single in a steel tube frame. Electric start, with a kick in case my battery is flat. 17″ wheels, big front disk, decent suspension, bright head/tail lights. Nothing else, unless its a rack to tie my lunchbox to.

    The Borile is the closest thing I can think of, although a somewhat stripped SR500 is right there too. No fancy nonsense, no electronics beside a CDI box. The CB450R mentioned a few days ago is just about ideal, except for its less-durable motor (I’d much prefer an XR lump for longevity).

  67. 7 years with the Honda 919…probably the perfect Universal Japanese Motorcycle…and It’s paid for, and still runs excellent, and looks the same. Now, this is Solo riding…with 2 up, get you a Gold Wing…

  68. Too bad you don’t work at a major manufacturer as a marketing exec.

    If you want to know why bikes keep getting more complicated and not necessarily better …. just go look at the marketing guys.

    Mabe you could explain to these stuffed shirt MBAs that more switches, electronics, design features …….. ad nauseum …… are not what the buying public wants.

    I agree with all the posters here who sing the praises of their plain jane standards from the last twenty or so years.

    Once we got past the 70s and the god awful UJMs of that era… the working parts of the bikes got better all along.

    But that’s not good enough for the high foreheads …. and they keep shovelling more crap that makes bikes less attractive…. and more expensive.

    Unfortunately … I think some of our bike manufacturers are going to GM themselves.

  69. OMMAG, you nailed my thoughts on the big 3 American auto mfgs. 500 hp cars are really cool but my 180 hp / 2 ton “mini” van is good enough. Even that has way more gadgets than I want to repair (I mean R E P L A C E) as it rolls into its 10th year. My bikes have points…

  70. My ’77 CB750 fits the bill for a bare bones and ridiculously cheap and easy to maintain bike. 55hp is plenty of pep, and my only complaint would be better braking.

  71. Why I love this list:

    50 cogent and on-point answers to a question about motorbikes and not a single one rambling off into politics, economics or healthcare issues.

    Way to go,folks!!

  72. @fireninja: Your first paragraph summed up the relative aspect of the whole “good enough” question quite nicely. Especially as you’ve had (I looked at your blog, very cool) a bunch of bikes to compare, both vintage (relative to our age group) and modern.

    @taxman (re: your first post): It sounds like you need a 650 Vstrom. I don’t have one, but I know people who do. From their experiences, and mine when riding their bikes, it seems the “CB-ness” of easy maintenance and reliability combined with the “Vtwin-ness” you are accustomed to is a perfect fit.

    For me, in heavy non-interstate traffic, I’d rather be on my TW200. But I wouldn’t want to ride a 1K day on it. That’s what my 13 year old BMW is for.

  73. @Taxman,

    If you want your Sporty to handle a bit better how about just doing a few mods? Some years ago there was a race class for Sportsters. There must be people out there somewhere who can steer you to some cheapish and easy suspension mods. Here is a link to a YouTube vid of a race.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2Ush-r7NXM

    I’ve never owned a Harley, but of all their models, the 883 Sportster would be my first choice by a huge margin.

    There is also a clip there (see the sidebar) of a Sportster race in Japan !

  74. I am definitely a “good enough” sort of guy and here’s the proof… while reading these posts I went to the fridge for a beer, saw there were no cool ones in there, so opened a warm one from the box. It’s fine.

  75. I had a 350 Morini dirtbike for many years and only sold it when kids came along. It wasn’t as fast as my Ducati but it was nice to ride and reliable. I still miss the Morini. Trailbikes are good and a Suzuki DRZ400 would do fine if I was on a budget – I’d have one tomorow as a second bike.

  77. The perfect good enough bike for me will be some kind of dual purpose. I don’t know what yet, but it’s going to be used for about everything, from commuting or running around town to 8hr trips to the mountains to camp for a few days including dirt roads getting there. I think the 650’s might be heavy in the dirt, but the 250’s would be slow on the highway. The DR-Z400 seems like it might just be good enough. If I never wanted to touch the dirt I would probably get an SV650 or Gladuis.

    Of course there’s tons of other bikes I’d like to have, but I won’t be getting any of them too soon. For now (or as soon as I find work) a good enough bike will still be great.

  78. When I was in kowledge I used to meet up with a 600 Dakar on the road (same time, same place almost every morning). We’d race to our first class. He’d easily pull away from my 750 bonnie. I’d miss shifts because of the overpowering exhaust note of his single. Where can I find a 20 year old Dakar?

  79. This was the perfect article to read this morning. Fantastic. Thank you.

    My ideal “good enough” bike would have the following characteristics:
    – Middleweight (500-800cc)
    – Usable power band around town, with comfortable cruise on the highway (ideally under 4000 RPM in 6th
    – CENTER STAND
    – Minimum of maintenance to maximize riding time, so EFI is a necessity
    – 200+ mile range
    – Ability to fit hard luggage (factory or aftermarket)
    – Good level of comfort so I can actually ride that 200+ mile range in one go
    – Enough power to cruise safely (with acceleration reserve) on the highway 2-up
    – Not to flashy, since I live in a city and have to park on the street at times

    Suzuki V-Strom perhaps? Any other suggestions?

  80. The key to “good enough” is the question: is it good enough for
    my needs? Sometimes these are known, sometimes not.

    For some, “good enough” will only ever equate with “latest and
    greatest”. For others, it will mean “designed to be the best
    possible at what it does”. Another group is “does it all adequately
    for a reasonable price”. All are valid, depending on your reference,
    so I find the argument somewhat subjective.

    In an auto context, Clarkson .(Top Gear) did a review of the Porsche
    Cayman a few years ago, and he hated it. The reason was not that
    it was a bad car (it isn’t) rather it was designed to fit into a marketing
    niche and thus not the best car it could be. He said that every time
    you pulled up next to a 911 you know that you are in a car designed
    to be inferior to the “top model”. This was not a matter of engineering
    or development cost or final product price, but a choice by the marketing
    department not to threaten sales of the more expensive model when
    it is clear that the Cayman could be been far superior dynamically to
    the 911.

    Basically, one man’s “good enough” is another’s Hell.

    m

  82. This is exactly the theory behind Mac Motorcycles. 50hp in 130kg bike gives enough power to have fun in a cost effective package. Roughly the same as my old RGV250 and that was more than enough to brown my trousers and put a grin on my face on several occasions!

  84. I guess it boils down to what is “good enough”. I loved my Bonneville, and when a road hazard flipped me, I wanted another Bonnie. Non were in stock, so I got a Street Triple for close to the same amount. Love that bike. Handles better, turns better, stops better, accelerates better, and better gas mileage.

    I don’t need a liter sportbike or a full dressed touring sofa, just a good solid bike. Now if any of the companies would just make another replacement for my old NX 650 single, I might learn to settle for a little less.

  85. This is how I feel about my ’05 883 Sportster. I commute to work and ride on weekends with it. It has enough low end power to move and I rarely ride above 70 on my usual non-interstate roads. When I get bored someday, maybe I’ll upgrade the engine to 1200 cc, but for right now it’s fine.

  86. nobody made what I wanted or what I could afford so I built my own. They are not for sale and I am never buying a new bike again. One is a custom FXR (looks more like a softail) with HD hardbags and 113″ of power, delivers 45mpg and rides 2 up in comfort at a cost of less than $15,000.00. The other is an HD which i modifed the frame with a 2″ stretch and added a 124 cubic inch kit. Based on the softail std. it can do everthing and yeilds 37 to 40 mpg everyday. Easily does low 11 sec quarters but can be a baby at 55 or more with 2 up in comfort all day anywhere. Not overly expensive when you do your own work but the manfacture can’t offer this on either bike new so I don’t buy new bikes. Either bike can be everything.

  87. I’m an American but I live and work in China. Around here, motorcycles are utilitarian forms of transport without the gloss of romanticism, cool or machismo that people in the States feel about their bikes. The legal limit is 200cc, and most of the common folk drive these miserable 150cc thumpers – old tech, slow, dead simple, sadly lacking in every way. But, to their way of thinking, “good enough”.
    I drive a grey market 250 Magna v-twin. A pale shadow of the old 1100 Yamaha I used to have, but way cooler than anything else in town. More than good enough – in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is King!

    I haven’t lived in the States in more than ten years. If I walked into a showroom now and saw what was on sale I’d probably pass out. Every bike is faster, more responsive, more reliable and just plain better in every measurable way than anything I can get here. Sure, I’d love the biggest and baddest, say a GS1200 BMW. But practically speaking? A new KLR650 with bags would do everything I could reasonably ask, and still go fast enough to get me into plenty of trouble if I wanted. You can’t buy a bad bike in America if you tried. Live it up, boys and girls. You don’t know how good you’ve got it!

  88. My first bike was a Honda Nighthawk 750. It went a lot faster than I would ever use, was inexpensive, and easy to maintain. My current bike is a Triumph Bonneville which I totally love! It’s simple, mechanically sound, and has better road manners than any other bike I have ever ridden. I am a believer in basic motorcycles!

    Plush and technologically advanced bikes are cool, but they are also expensive to buy, expensive to maintain, and expensive to fix. Thats ok for someone with a lot of time and/or resources, but give me basic and reliable!

  90. I think a “good enough” motorcycle like described in the original post is the very essence of the sport we so dearly love. People started riding Enfields when they were a bear to start and completely destructive to your back. Did this stop anyone from going out and buying them and eventually absolutely adoring them? Definitely not. Bikes just like…well everything, has witnessed some form of progression; however, the purest in all of us will get on a simple bike or a “good enough” bike and absolutely fall in love. Just my 02 cents.

  92. I built my “good enough bike” because I didn’t like the standard factory bikes. It is an old Yamaha XV920 (with the eclosed chain) wich I already bought 17 years ago. Made it 50 pounds lighter. Gave it some modern wheels, suspension and brakes (XJR 1300). Improved the intake and exhaust (power now 70 bhp.at the wheel). Took it one week after finishing to the black forest (Germany) and back, and clocked 1100 miles in 4 days. The guys with the modern bikes (100-140 bhp) did not believe at first that I could follow them. I proofed them wrong.

  93. hoyt 09.03.09 at 11:45 am
    “Good to see the ‘Slider isn’t blocked in China. (oops, now it might be)”

    Lord knows they’re throwing up walls right and left, so you gotta be sneaky to get around them. So long as we don’t talk about religion or politics, we should be ok. For now!

  94. America missed out on one of the best all rounders ever made ! the Suzuki GSX1400.
    With a pipe it will put out at least 115hp with 130NM of torque, it is comfortable for 2 people, it has over 10 litres of storage under the seat, it is super reliable (my bike has 137,000km on it and has NEVER needed a valve adjustment) it looks like a 70’s muscle bike, it’s easy to work on, it’s cheap and in the right hands it will give most sports bikes a BIG hurry up. Just check the internet for the 1400 owners club. We wont sell our bikes because nothing exists to trade them in on !

  96. Agree totally with John Findlay, it’s a real shame that HD helped to keep the GSX1400 out of the states as you guys would have loved it, big / torquey with japanese reliabilty and a really low price compared to just about anything else in the class. I have tried many many other makes / types of bike inc HD (which I hated with a passion – would have happily pushed it into a field and set fire to it) and nothing ticks the ‘all round’ boxes like the 14 does.

  97. I’ve been riding GSX1400’s for five years now. Clocked 75,000kms on them and have ridden a lot of other bikes and bikes that are way up there in the handling department.
    I’ve yet to ride anything better than the GSX1400.
    I still love these bikes and will mourn the day they are no longer available.

    I feel more at home pushing one of these machines at speed through the tight stuff than I have on any other bike and I’m talking top end KTM Super Duke R’s and Aprilia Tuonos and R1’s, GSX1000’s and Speed Triples and whatever else.

    They are quite simply the best value for money and the most fun to ride but you can also tour with them and they just do everything well.

    It’s a crying shame the USA missed out on these bikes.

  98. as above fellas have said…..GSX1400 is the best all round bike i’ve ever had,and if the HD boys think they can do Bling…….no chance…lol

  99. here’s mine,..’more than good enough’ -Ducati Monster 900/1000 – you can commute on it, tour on it, and it wheelies off the throttle. The fact that it still looks contemporary after 15 odd years is rather incredible.I’d dare to say, one of the best and most significant bikes ever made.

  101. Will all the standard and sport types bikes making the list, I thought I would chime in with my 2007 Suzuki Boulevard M50. It’s good enough for me. 2 up no problem, highway speeds are a breeze, I have twisty fun with it and it’s paid for. Its a crusier with the soul of a sporty standard.
    Love it

  102. I’ll chime in a second time. Having owned over 60 motorcycles and never leaving any as they came I guess i need to really comment on what this is really about. There have been motorcycles that are good enough and many engines over the years have been good enough but not continued. They are good enough for a fairly long production run but then get discontinued if sales slip. They really often need only a face lift or a chassis update or an engine tweek and then on to the next 6 to 10 years. We have forgotten the many bikes that got us here. I prefer simple machines. No alarm systems, no fancy electronics that tie me to a dealer, no stereo, no ABS. The masses need basic but fun motorcycles but the magizines don’t like them, the dealers don’t and the factory doesn’t. Not enough money in those. Heck most sales people in dealerships hardly ever ride but yet describe to the customer what is best. So far the only company that has continued on this path is Harley Davidson but even they have figured out since we entered the 2000’s that if you complex your machines more you tie them to the dealership, making more money. So really who is going to build the next “good enough”?

  103. People need to get there heads out of the sand and take a walk on the wild side??
    You “cannot” beat a big air cooled inline Jap four. After all the GS1000 is the grandaddy of the GSX1400, and if im not mistaken, was launced in the U.S. and the Yanks loved it.
    Reliable, torquey, and a real looker. With a couple of suspension tweaks and the addition of a less restrictive exhaust, these bikes can give, and sometimes outgun other more recognized pocket rockets, a run for there money.
    These bikes hold there price for a reason. People like them!!! a future classic.

  104. The Bandit 1250 nails it as far as big inline four japanese bikes go…and it´s a real good looker.

  106. Dan sure Steve talks some sense, hitting te nail on the head regarding good bikes that get discarded by manufacturers in the pursuit of “progress” which predominantly comes down to foisting fashion on the punter.

    A regards my personal choice I’ve owned a few that would make the grade, Triumph Sprint RS, Harley D FXD Supergilde and Honda F6C Valkyrie to name but 3. Top of the pile for me though is y present steed, a Suzuki GSX1400. Fun fu fun at ANY speed, awesome two-up and just te most handsome slab of muscle bike ever produced.

    Sadly they ain’t produced any longer for Europe and never were for the USA which has to be one of the craziest marketing decisions ever made!

    Ride safe and long, guys!

  107. Absolutely. I rode a Kawasaki EX 500/Ninja 500R, for eleven years, before I had the means to purchase my Harley. my “good enough” bike was what I could afford at the time. It served me well for three years in Germany, has been a daily commuter, has seen touring duty, and is still reliable enough, that on the rare chance I get to pull her out of storage she starts and rides like the day I bought her. (Thank you Sta-Bil). My “good enough” bike will always hold a special place in my heart. I look forward to the day, when I can pass it down to my son… or do the wicked supermoto mod that’s been scratching at the back of my brain for a couple of years…

  108. I love my 2006 Triumph Bonneville. It might not be my first choice to ride to South America, but I don’t want for other bikes when I’m out riding.

  109. The problem with giving people what they want, is that it isn’t necessarily what they NEED. Cruisers don’t have excessive performance of sportbikes,so they won’t kill you with outright speed, but they have riding positions and styling that are painful to me. Sportbikes and Cafe Racers are more up my alley, but the majority of those are WAY beyond my needs. The most fun I ever had on a motorcycle was a 1974 Suzuki GT380 that I found buried up to its axles in mud, and rebuilt my own way, heavily modified with parts that made it perform to MY needs. It wasn’t fast, but it was fun. People nowadays think that the only way to have fun on a motorcycle is with the fastest, best braking, best handling, most radically-styled bike they can buy. The problem isn’t the manufacturers, it’s the customers. We are a society of “bigger, better, faster, more.” Until we as riders learn that we don’t NEED anything more than a basic motorcycle, manufacturers won’t make many of them. They’re making too much money building what we WANT.

  110. what made the Honda CB750 the king of the road?a bike that could do everything at least ok,+ something more,at a time of less specialisation.for me + most of my cohorts of the time,it was our only means of transport.so it had to take us thousands of miles to + from the rallies,work+pub!unfortunately,todays society doesn,t allow evolution.if it did I would be riding a 750cc Bandit(oil) weighing 400lbs,making 100bhp.