Harley Davidson has so far visited 3 of 4 potential locations for a new Harley Davidson factory in anticipation of a possible shutdown of the York, PA facility. The cities in contention are Shelbyville, Ind., Murfreesboro, Tenn., and Shelbyville, Ky. The 4th city has not yet been visited so the name has not been disclosed. (See update below)
The York facility is still being studied to determine whether it should be closed or updated. A decision is expected before the end of the year.
Link: Business Journal
UPDATE: The fourth city being considered is Kansas City, MO, which was revealed after a visit Thursday by Harley officials. Kansas City is currently the location of one plant, this would add a second plant next to the current facility on land already owned by Harley Davidson.
Link: KansasCity.com
UPDATE 2: Interesting quote from article linked below:
The York operations are not competitive or sustainable long-term as they are now structured, company spokesman Bob Klein said.
Harley also says work rules and job classifications at the (York) plant limit its ability to be competitive. “There’s a need for much greater flexibility in the work we do there,” Klein said.
Food for thought.
Link: JournalSentinel
Tin Man 2 says
What would happen to the old building? Im tired of seeing old infrastructure simply abandoned while Big Tax breaks are given for New construction. Companys should not be permitted to walk away from their old sites, The area should be returned to its natural condition, maybe using the Tax abaitment money already granted to the MoCo. This Whipsawing between the states is creating a factory ghetto in many areas. Living in Michigan I resent the small percent of our past Federal Tax Dollars that were used in Michigan, Instead our Tax money went South and is used to Bribe Manufactures to relocate there.
Terry Lectka says
It seems to me that the time is right for Harley to look at it’s neighbor across the Lake (Michigan). With economic hard times afflicting the state of Michigan it seems as if a potential bargain could be struck that might benefit both parties. I am quite sure that many unemployed workers are probably diehard Harley fans, and would love to help the cause of another American manufacturer with their manufacturing expertise. Let’s utilize the facilities and expertise we still have.
Richard Gozinya says
One surprising thing about that list, so far, only one is in a right to work state (Murfreesboro, TN). Looks like Harley’s not following the trend of anti-union attitudes, and instead judging states on the size of the bribe offered.
taxman says
many states, michigan included, provide tax abatements to refurbish existing buildings. it really only postpones the problem though. in michigan our tax abatements only last 12 years. so once the abatement ends it is difficult to keep someone from looking around at other places that are offering new incentives.
Azzy says
Tinman… companies moved south where companies were not forced to do the bidding of the politicians and union reps up north.
HoughMade says
I love the state of my birth, Michigan…but it is business UNFREINDLY. Indiana, Kentucky and Tennessee all make better financial sense. Locating a plant is not a social service project. It’s profit motivated…and should be.
todd says
HoughMade said it right. Harley will move to where it makes the most sense financially, whether from muni bribes (I mean “incentives”), labor cost, or whatever.
I have a hunch, though, that Mexico is not the unnamed location…
-todd
kim says
“Making most sense financially” would be China, particularly when it comes to labor costs and dealing with unions.
zip22 says
financially, you would need to include the significant blow to their reputation and the corresponding drop in sales – which I think would outweigh the benefit of cheap labor. poorer quality or the policing to keep quality at acceptable levels would also incur costs.
Kurt says
Makes you wonder if this is why they cancelled Buells plan for a new facility. Go figure.
Steve says
And they said “the south shall rise again”, but I don’t think they ever meant, manufacturing. I sometimes don’t understand how totally building new can be more productive,cost effective and better than install the same tooling and methods where you already have a facility. There must be some stagering $$$$ being offered.
John says
Kim,are you serious?Moving to China makes the most financial sense?How is that?They would loose every diehard Harley enthusiast including me.Quality would go down the tubes,reputation lost,they’d be out of buisiness directly and deservidly so.Glad they don’t listen to you.
JR says
John, I think Kim just meant in terms of manufacturing costs and the fact that Harley wouldn’t have to pay huge wages to union workers for the same amount of work completed.
I’m pretty sure Kim understands that there are many diehard Harley fans that wouldn’t stand for Harley’s being built anywhere but here.
kneeslider says
Please note the update to the post, Kansas City is the 4th city being considered.
Tin Man 2 says
JR, I for one will keep a close eye on what HD does as to location. HD has a dedicated hard working workforce right where they are in Penn. If the management devolves into Union busting so as to keep executive compensation at current levals, They will loose much support from working men. As to the outrage at the China joke, Well that is the moral equivelent of moving out state to bust the Union. The quality of HD is legendary, This is in part,a result of a stable Workforce. Yes some changes in work rules and broadening Job classifications may be in order, But the value of a stable decently paid workforce cant be overstated. Can you imagine the money HD has spent on this exploring of new locations,travel,meetings,time and executive compensation?
blackheart says
About production in China: the company I used to work for moved production to China, and in spite of the enormous time, effort, and cost to transfer the production line, the company doubled its profits. Same product, same processes. Just lower labor costs, lower site costs, and probably some other expenses that I don’t know about. But financially, it was a success since the customers didn’t care where the product was made, only that it worked as advertised.
kim says
Jon, Zip22 and JR – The mere thought of H-D moving to China is utterly ridiculous, as indeed sales would drop like a rock. H-D seems to be as much about myth and history, as about actual rolling hardware. My comment was not about what H-D would or should realistically do, but rather about the attitudes towards trade unions and the way companies treat their workforce.
kim says
Tin man 2 – Thanks for getting the China joke right away.
JC says
“The quality of HD is legendary”
Unfortunately true.
The AMF years aren’t forgotten by many, including my dad, who I can hardly convince that Harley’s are actually reliable and great bikes once again.
Tom says
HDI – gotta ‘nother place to consider: San Angelo, Texas. The land for the factory will be a nickel on the dollar of those other sites, and you can get skilled craftsmen to build the factory cheap (especially if your contrators don’t check papers). San Angelo is convenient to the ports of Houston and Manzanillo for shipping components in and finished bikes out (I hardly need to remind you that you’re exporting a third of your production these days). Taxes and wages are low in this right to work state and I guarantee you’ll have 100+ folks apply for every position you got. This little city is just west of the Hill Country, one of the finest 12 months-a-year riding areas in the USA.
Ride down. Check it out.
Kenny says
Why does China always get such a slagging. Some people seem to think that all china is , is a bunch of yokels in straw hats up to their ankles in mud, growing rice. China has a huge manufacturing industry and many decent colleges pumping out engineers, scientists etc.
In my opinion quality has very little to do with the work force. If the design is good and the nessescary quality controls and management are in place then there is no real reason that quality standards can’t be maintained. If an employee can’t or won’t perform his/her work up to spec. Well there are hundreds of people at the door queing up for his job.
Also, I thought that Harley had a fair amount of components sourced from abroad and Harleys were really just “Proudly Assembled In America”
John says
kim,glad you weren’t serious but blackheart your not a very clear thinker if you really think that would be a good idea.And to JC I know what your saying is somewhat true but my first bike was a 74 Sporty that I traded for a 73 Superglide and I never had problems with either bike.At the time 5 of my buddies also bought new HD’s,74-77’s and I don’t remember any issues with any of them so I believe that notion is exagerated.
Nicolas says
Better than Kansas or China, check this one out :
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/harley-davidson-to-flood-india-with-motorcycles.htm
it’s about HD selling on the indian market … with local assembly involved.
Tin Man 2 says
Kenny, China can cut costs because they use people like cannon fodder, Have you not seen the pollution, The tin shacks 70% of their population lives in, The Videos of Clubbing protesters who try to lift the standard of living for the workers? Is our Greed so strong that we turn our sight from the abuses used to deliver cheap products to our shores? What about Human Rights? Why is most Chrome Plating done offshore now? I guess we need safety standards, but to H with everyone else!
todd says
That’s why I suggested Mexico. Labor and location is still dirt cheap and shipping can still be done with the current truck contracts.
Besides, if they’re made in Mexico they’d still be able to say “Made in America”.
-todd
blackheart says
John: nowhere did I say moving production was a good idea. i gave an example of what one company did and the results. By the way, many of the components in a Harley are bought from the far east. Harley boutiques have many items made overseas but I haven’t heard any complaints about the origin of these items.
Greybeard says
If it’s labor cost at the bottom of this I say shame on H-D.
Let’s dismiss the fact that markets are flat. That’s strictly business cycles at work.
What about profit margin and not gross profits?
Harley doesn’t make enough off their sweat shop produced accessories to support skilled union employees?
The same people who brought them back from the brink of disaster?
SHAME on Harley.
Kenny says
Tin Man 2,
I think we’ve had this argument before, I was looking at it from a purely economical/engineering perspective. If you want to put in a human rights perspective then how do you improve their living standard if you don’t give them work. Do you sit back and say “No, I’m not giving you any work until everyone has clean running water, 100 square meter homes, cheap electricity, 10Mb broadband, Tivo and 2.3 children”
History repeats itself, The industrial revolution anybody, the great depression?
Ian says
I really would like them to pick Murfreesboro, mainly becuase I’m moving to TN sometime in the future, and a job at an HD factory would be sooooo cool.
PaulN says
I am staggered by the volume of responses on this subject! Did someone build a bike out of unobtanium in their basement? Who cares. Did a motorcycle go to Mars. Big deal! This subject gets all the traffic.
On the other hand, it is good to know that our breed cares about America and its connection to our culture, despite the bashing that Harley bikes typically receive in this forum.
I just hope the The Company doesn’t AMF-themselves on this move.
John says
blackheart,you and others that don’t like Harley for whatever reason like to use the argument that they are only assembled from asian parts.How do you guys get so expert on a product you probably have so little interest in?Harley Davidson builds in the U.S. the motors,transmissions,frames and all the body parts.That IS the Motorcycle,items from elswhere are the starter,gauges and forks.The carburaters were Kiehen but as all HD’s are fuel injected that is no more.
Blaine Newell says
Hi there. Building a new plant, instead of remodling. If they build a new plant, they won’t interfere with production. The new plant can be laid out in a much more productive fashion. Remodling an old plant, always requires major compromises. Things like modern heating and cooling, ventilation. The new one can be built with much more efficient shipping and handling. Getting the parts to the assembly lines can be all computerized, and on belt fed systems. There are a lot of advantages to building a new plant. Blaine
frozen prairie says
Why not just build a new facility in York? All the benefits mentioned by Blaine would apply and the trained workers are right there already. They’d just have to ride to a different building to go to work.
57xl says
just a thought for the AMF haters….
no AMF years = No HD today.
Post*in*KC.MO says
I live in KC.MO.
The residents of KC and i were delighted to hear about the great news from H-D,
we have a strong worker base here in KC. with one fully operational Harley plant,
One strong ford plant, and our GM plant that has managed to stay up and running with no layoffs.
This city is centrally located in the country, with alot of rail yards, and easy acsess to many trucking companies…KC. is often refered to as a shipping hub…
So to the H-D executives who already own a massive amount of real estate here,
I say bring it on..KC has proven to be “in it” for the long haul, and has been a gold mine for many others who have been faced with these decisions before.!
…Long Live Harley…
WRXr says
I don’t think you are a “Harley Hater”, if bring up the topic of many of the parts being made overseas. That’s the world we live in. It’s a global economy. Harley is a premium brand. Why shouldn’t they go overseas to get what they deem to be the best stuff? I have no argument with that.
Likewise, If they built a plant in Mexico or China, I would have no argument with that either, just so long as the product was as good or better than what they currently make. Being “American” surely hasn’t stopped Ford or GM from building some really quality goods overseas.
I might point out, being foreign hasn’t stopped BMW, Honda or Toyota from building in the US, either.
John says
wrx,you don’t get it.I doubt that you own or ride a Harley,and your speaking as a consumer of an appliance.If Harley was to build a plant in say China to build for the locals,so what I would not have any problem with that.But if they closed down production in the US to move all production to China or any other country that would be the end of them.
SteveD says
I agree with John. A large part of the Harley attraction is the American Brand aspect. If they shut down their American plants and moved overseas that woudl lose a lot of sales. Honda, Star, etc. make gerat cruisers and become much more comp[etitive if you take away the American edge. Besides, why bother? If the Japanese companies can make stuff int the US, why can’t American companies?
DR says
============================
“The quality of HD is legendaryâ€
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Yeah, right…. do a search on “XR1200 bent cylinder fins”
Sounds like 1974 AMF all over again.
The Man says
With the 4 other locations incentives on the table, Harley-Davidson could be using the potential relocation to leverage its opportunities in negotiations with the Union, said THE MAN. “Otherwise, why would you retrain employees and go through the moving costs? It just doesn’t make sense to me,” said THE MAN.