Computers, digital cameras and cellphones keep going down in price, we’ve come to expect it with anything electronic, could it be electric motorcycles will follow suit? Maybe. Brammo announced they are lowering the price of the Enertia to $7995. Combined with a 10% tax credit, your final price is $7195. Compared to the initial $11,995, that’s quite a deal.
Walk into a Best Buy store stocking the bike, or go to the Brammo website, and put down $2000, add a 24 month zero interest loan with payments of $249 per month and you’re set. It’s an electric motorcycle that has become affordable and with a top speed of 60 mph and an average range of 42 miles, for some folks, it might now be practical, too.
This could be a perfect commuter ride for a lot of people, if you have less than 40 miles one way, you ride to work, plug in to a wall outlet and recharge for the ride home. If you work close to home, it might just be an overnight charge for the next day’s commute.
This is one of those moments when we will see if all of the verbal support from electric motorcycle enthusiasts translates into real world sales. If it does, big things could start to happen. This will be worth watching.
Link: Brammo
Tin Man 2 says
Now the Rubber meets the road! The only question is how long does the Battery Pack last? 2Yrs,4Yrs and what does the pack cost? This is really starting to look good!!
HowardsCustoms says
Not bad at all! Looks pretty nice too. Still a tough sell when lined up against some petrol bike, but it is a step closer.
Mark X says
Wonderful concept. Clever marketing. The only problem that I can see is that this is still a very limited use urban/short hop devise. When it does’t sell in huge numbers,(as it surely will not), I hope that further development is not discouraged. Electric vehichles are the way of the future, for us all. RideSafe, Mark.
HoughMade says
I have always liked the Brammo Enertia. It’s got classic proportions with a modern look. By all accounts, it works very well for its intended purpose. At $12,000, it would have been a boutique machine for a few to show off their far-sightedness for a price. At near $7,000, it’s getting close to the point where someone could justify it on economics. I don’t know that’s its all the way there, but getting close. That being said, I’m taking a look at it. I love the smell of gas, even with 2 stroke oil, but I like this bike.
Dorzok says
Check out Jay Leno’s garage. He’s a video of him riding his and interviewing a Brammo dude. Answers some questions. This bike is ALMOST perfect for me. All it needs is passenger accomdations and luggage capabilities. I commute maybe 25 miles on surface streets and have to be able to carry my son, his books, and store his gear after I drop him of at school. I’d pay the $7,995 for it too. BRAMMO are you listening?
Hawk says
Very interesting. So far this year, I’ve burned $1700 worth of fuel in my bike and another $400 in the cage. The Brammo would have cost me about $125, probably less because I would plug into someone else’s power half the time. Even forgetting about the insurance saving, the Brammo would pay for itself in about 3 years.
Too bad I’m retired and don’t commute anymore. My weekend rides are 600 to 800 kms so an electric just isn’t going to cut it. But, if I was still working, I’d have one in a minute … even on the Wet Coast of BC. A nip down I-5 to Ashland would be a pleasure.
LittleTurtle says
I think this is huge, there are a lot of states that have additional state tax rebates. If I got one I’d get another $1500 from state kickbacks in addition to the federal 10% back. That makes the Enertia just under $5700. And with only $2000 down, depending on your fuel bill, I think it’s poised to become not just an environmentally green decision, but green is the color of money also. I just makes sense.
zyxw says
I wonder if it can reliably recharge enough during an 8-hour workday to take someone 30 miles back home? Or is it like a lot of other electric rechargeable devices that promise X number of hours of use, but in reality deliver 1/2 X hours. That is my usual rule of thumb with rechargeables–take the manufacturer’s claims and divide by two.
broke says
dorzok, I saw a picture on autoblog of Brammo branded saddlebags for it, no second seat, but least it’ll be an option.
http://www.blogcdn.com/green.autoblog.com/media/2009/09/brammo-enertia-facebook-3.jpg
todd says
Looks like it’s coming further into range for slightly less than the most wealthy people. For me, it has to compete with a number of motorcycles already in my garage (i.e. FREE) that can handle freeway speeds for hours on end (32 mile one-way commute) or my Peugeot moped which also costs very little to run and handles surface streets just fine. For someone trying to justify this economically the ready comparison is made against a near perfect $2000 Ninja 250 that gets 70 mpg.
Still this is cool and I’d love to have one just for the fun of it but I have exactly ZERO budget for that.
-todd
pabsy says
Arghh !! i want this to wooooork ! but it doesn’t
What a shame to squander a partnership with Best Buy and great promotional skill with economics that don’t work and a technology that isn’t ready (battery)
Craig Bramsher is clearly a brilliant guy, imagine what he could accomplish with a real, not an idealogical, product to sell
-$7k is too high, you can buy 3 new honda ruckus for that, they sip gas, and are way better on invironment than these low life batterys
-The people surveyed that indicated they would buy one (like some folks on this board) then go ahead and don’t buy one…at this price anyways
-TinMan2 has it right whats the operating cost factoring and battery life and replacement? i think it will be shocking and why no mention on their website ?
-Its not for highway use, would you go on a highway with a bike that struggles to 60?
-The premise of the bike is wrong imo, The average biker won’t ride it and the non biker will want an appliance like a scooter, oh and non biker girls especially will want a scooter so they don’t have to stradde it, sexist ? sure but true
-who services and repairs it ? not BB thats for sure, especially when its discontinued
-They should back their claims up with independant testing, I don’t beleive for a minute these claims are for anything other than optimized conditions rather than real world stop and go, headwind, incline, hot days etc etc
I’m not meaining to hate on it, I admire their efforts and especially their 3rd place TT showing but this will be a collossal fail because the product is wrong and that will set them back or worse
kneeslider says
pabsy, “this will be a collossal fail”
Or you might wait to see what happens before pronouncing it a failure.
For the rest of us who are not absolutely certain what other people will do, it’s often a good idea to try something and find out and then adjust our business model as we gather information. Try, learn, adjust, try again, learn more, adjust again, repeat until the goal is attained. That works for me, your mileage may vary.
Scott says
I can’t figure why many ‘negative’ people expect motorcycle companies to get everything absolutey right with electric bikes the very first time, or even the second. Do you really think Honda’s first bike was perfect, or the second, or the ……
You need to, like Kneeslider says, “wait and see what happens…”
FREEMAN says
Here’s a review by Engadget from back in June for those of you that are interested. It answers some questions about battery life and replacement costs.
I’m glad to see the price come down and the ravailable rebates. Too bad most of my commute is highway. Maybe their next version/model will handle the highway.
GenWaylaid says
If my budget wasn’t so limited I’d seriously consider one of these. True, I often ride 100 miles in one day on the weekends, which poses recharging problems. The real issue is that my Honda Trail 110 cost me only $1800 in near-new condition. The difference of $6400 buys at least two thousand gallons of gas, which would get me two hundred thousand miles. That’s longer than the bike is likely to last. (The comparison isn’t perfect because the Brammo has better performance, but not really enough to make the leap to being freeway-capable.)
Even without considering the environmental impact of building a new motorcycle versus getting an old one back on the road, I suspect my money could do more to reduce my carbon footprint if I simply replaced my appliances or bought a small windmill or a couple solar panels.
While I really want to support electric motorcycles, I just can’t make an economic case for it yet. Brammo might have a good strategy in aiming for the underserved market for small commuter bikes, but that’s not to say they’re the best deal, especially when they’re competing against used bikes. It may be the high-end electric sportbikes derived from TTX-GP competitors that succeed in the end, because they’re less constrained by notions of practicality.
chaz says
The Enertia should probably be judged against the cheap little Chinese bikes and scooters as they fulfill the same role. The price differential and range are heavily in favor of the imports, but they have questionable reputations for durability and support from the manufacturers. If the quality of the Enertia is better and the range can be extended, it will be competitive. I suspect that Brammo is not expecting to sell large quantities of this model, but want to establish the brand. And they must be looking over their shoulder, as the big Japanese companies are now showing electric vehicles.
pabsy says
Freeman thanks for the link
So $3000 batteries and they claim a 35k life (which I dont believe) and a 45 mile round trip IF you maintain 25mph !
what is the degradation curve over the life of that battery ? what happems in less than ideal conditions? or you forget to plug in, half worn batteries after 10k miles, inclines, fat riders, 100 degree days, stop and go traffic and lets also presume you don’t want to wind up back at your dooorstep with 1 mile left in the tank…btw do you have an electric plug at your doorstep or do you park on the street or parking garage, its a city bike right ?
practically then due to the above lets cut the range in half over the life cycle of the bike, and i think im bieng generous, you have a 20miles round trip if you want a couplle miles to spare, thats 10 miles one way, i dont know about you but i cant plug in at my place of work,
so who can use a vehicle for $7k (after your taxdollar rebate !) with $3k batteries with a practical 20 mile range ?
just about no body, or those with think its green, its not, it has a giant nasty low life battery that has to be thrown away
or put it another way if this were a gas bike with equivelant price and power would it be a joke correct ?
Why otherwise reasonable people would ignore all this I dont understand, I want electric power green energy too but this isn’t it, its horrible.
As for Brammo I think they are intentionally mis-leading with their website because they mislead by omission, it will catch up and bite them in the rear
Kneeslider your absolutely right this is my opinion, but its a reasonable one
FREEMAN says
@ pabsy: if you don’t want to believe the 35k battery life, their official site claims 2000 recharges instead as the battery life. If you get exactly 45 miles per charge and 2000 charges out of it, that would be 90,000 miles per set of batteries. So in all fairness, that 35k estimate is probably the practical number of the two.
kneeslider says
How many people buy a Prius because it’s the most cost effective choice? They buy to show their very obvious green credentials to everyone, it makes them feel good. A small gas powered economy car that works better from a dollars and cents standpoint wouldn’t have those benefits.
Potential Brammo buyers aren’t doing a this versus that comparison, they’re wondering if they can afford it and if it will be somewhat usable. They’ll park it next to their Prius.
Billy B. Tso says
sounds like a usable ride…would actually suit my riding…but damn it’s ugly!!! that is the ONLY reason why i won’t buy it, sorry to say….hope the design hits a cord with others and it succeeds, so that Brammo designs a ‘better looking’ second generation bike…
pabsy says
Freeman; fair enough, my experiencee with our GEM car (which is a cute looking joke) is battery degradation is pretty severe over time, prob a diff technology, therefore if the Brammo battery suffers degradation over time, which it will, what is the true mileage before throwing it away as the degrading number compounds over time, a bit like interest on your money except in reverse !
Did brammo factor in degradation or do simple math…
Kneeslider: the Prius is within the same price / performance envelope as the competition with 10% or whatever and therfore makes for a viable alternative I like it
The brammo doesn’t and isnt even close, your comparison isnt valid
If your telling me a small number of people will buy it because they just want to then I agree with you ! but it won’t be enougth of a number to satisfy Best Buy that operates in the real world, which is why in my opinion iits failure is pretty much a no brainer
JSH says
Brammo is not competing for the same customer that would purchase a used Ninja 250! Come on, the majority of people are not practical. They don’t do a cost analysis to determine what method of transportation is the most cost effective. People buy motorcycles based on emotion and image.
I’ve also not heard anyone mention the Brammo’s number one advantage. It is an automatic. What are your available options if you want to purchase and automatic motorcycle? I can think of the FJR1300AE ($16,290), Honda DN-01 ($15,599), and the Aprilia Mana ($9,899). In that company $8K for a Brammo doesn’t sound all that expensive. Vespa sells plenty of $5,000 scooters to those that don’t want to learn to shift a motorcycle.
I personally don’t think Brammo is trying to sell the Enertia to current motorcyclists. Instead they are trying to win over a few of the 98% of the population that currently does not ride. That helps explain the sales channel. I can already envision the sales pitch now. Salesman: “It is as easy as riding a bicycle but you don’t have to peddle.” Maybe they can convince a few bicycle commuters to leave their $5000 road bikes in the garage.
pabsy says
JSH honda ruckus $2200
JSH says
Pabsy: Honda Ruckus 40 mph. You can’t safely ride a Ruckus on the 45 mph to 55 mph streets that make up the bulk of the metro area I live in. The Enertia can at least keep up with traffic.
You also seem to be missing my point about different markets. How many non-riders have every visited a Honda dealership so that they could be exposed to a Ruckus? Compare that to the number of non-riders that visit a Best Buy on a regular basis.
pabsy says
JSH
Im kidding about the ruckus its anemic, although for $3k there are twist and go scooters that will do it easily, by the way 60mph is top speed on a Brammo so i think it will be a scary ride in a 45-55 but on anything other than a fresh battery on full charge on a flat surface blah blah you get the idea
I think you have a great point about selling it as more of a cool appliance at an electronics store, there is a ton of exposure to people that would never dream of stepping in a bike store. I think that part of their program is really smart and smart strategy on their part, i think Best Buy has equity in Brammo too if i recall
Also it will serve as a kind of shield to what the rest of the market is doing which is also good for brammo
The lack of gearchange is def a plus as is a lack of noise and the general grease and smeilliness of a gas bike
non of it overcomes a crappy range, a crazy price and the need to run a cable to it for 3 hours
LittleTurtle says
Re: pabsy – Do your research man! Hell for Leather independently verified that the bike promises 60, and delivers 65. A rider in Portland (PNW Rider’s Club) test rode one from the Portland Best Buy store and said he went 70. There’s been a few other reports of hitting 70. There are a couple places on the internet where Brammo says, “we will under promise and over deliver”. You are going to get what they claim. And you know what everyone says after they get off? It’s a BLAST to ride.
I’ve ridden it a couple times and I agree completely. I’m saving up to buy one and here’s why (JSH was right on the money) – I would have never considered a motorcycle. They sounded fun but it was something I wasn’t going to get into. I live 20 miles from work, freeway the whole way. My wife and I shared a car, and it’s getting too hard to coordinate. so it was buy a new car, maintain it, buy fuel, buy insurance, etc. Or get an Enertia. A little more expensive, but no maintenance except the chain. I can handle that. cost to drive, almost nil, and my boss is totally cool about letting me recharge at work. Because there’s no gas or oil I can wipe it down real quick and roll it right into the office. on the carpet and everything. and for $2000 down and $250/month, then getting lots of tax rebates back, it actually is a good economic decision. YES THERE ARE CHEAPER ALTERNATIVES, but there’s definitely a cool factor there too. And ease of use. And it seriously is a blast to ride. Save your critique until you’ve seen one in person and taken it out for a ride.
FREEMAN says
@ LittleTurtle:
I was waiting for someone with first hand experience to chime in. I have not had the pleasure. I wanted to ask you though, does it handle hills pretty well? Just curious.
B*A*M*F says
I’ve got a modern scooter, a Peugeot 150, and I do use it to ride to work. This would be an equally ideal vehicle for me to ride to work. My commute is 16 miles round trip each day. I can commute about 6 months out of the year in Kansas City on a bike.
My scooter, in 2003, was a bit less than half the price of the Enertia. So at this point, the price is high compared to a conventionally powered bike. Then again, it’s relatively new technology, or at least a new combination of existing technologies. There is a premium for being an early adopter. When the iPhone was introduced, it was $600, these days you can get a refurb for $50. This is the first price drop of many that will come on electric vehicles.
I’m also not too worried about the batteries on this bike. Better ones will be available for better prices in the next few years, and folks with electronic talent will be able to swap new ones in. Eventually, there will be kits to upgrade the batteries so your average shadetree bike mechanic could do the job him/herself. It’s an exciting time to be riding.
B*A*M*F says
Also, I really like the look of this bike. It’s got a very vintage silhouette. It’s slim, light looking, and has a standard riding position. And seriously, where else can you find a new standard bike weighing less than 350lb, of any displacement?
Jacquie says
I like to a large extent. It looks light enough to handle well. It picks up a lot of the esthetics I always liked about 250-500 singles. The price whoof! But this could be my future or something like it.
pabsy says
thats great can you post the link ?
nortley says
If this is to be a practical, get around the city rig, it should have weather protection and luggage capacity, racks and/or bags. From the general look of the Enertia, some sort of quick detach lugs could accommodate light bodywork. As shown in the pictures, its just right for a fair weather put… purr, but that’s only part of the year. I’ve seen mention elsewhere that the quietness of these machines can be a hazard to pedestrians, animals, and the rider, who doesn’t get the aural feedback that helps control the right hand and his speed. Ironically, it might be a good idea to put a sound generator aboard to be switched on in congested areas. To warn properly, it should sound distictly like a motorcycle of the mellow, innoffensve sort, like, say, a Velocette. Just enough sound to announce its presence. For the riders benefit, helmet speakers could be driven by a speed and “throttle” position sound generator. No limit to sound choice or volume now – fancy the sound of a Honda 6 or a steam locomotive? Turn it up. I like the Enertia, but to crack the market I think they’re aimed at it has to be both practical and fun. Put on some universal tires, some clearance under the fenders, and make that bodywork bash resistant, and I might take a closer look.
FREEMAN says
@ nortley:
It doesn’t need a sound generator. Here’s a video review from 2008 and from the many shots of it riding by you can hear for yourself that it is not silent. Silent electric bikes are a myth. There are gas bikes (and cars!) out there just as quiet as this one and you never hear anybody saying they need a sound generator. Also, in the review, they mention that it was designed to be extremely narrow and centralized for urban commuting. So adding a bunch of crap like saddle bags and fenders not only adds unnecessary weight, but makes it much more bulky, which is not only bad for battery life but commuting in places like NY, for instance.
Kenny says
Why are they selling this in the US?????? The motherland of the highway.
I would think they would have a much bigger market in Europe or the richer parts of Asia much like the old joke “An American thinks a 100 years is a long time and a European thinks a 100 miles is a long distance”.
Scotduke says
The price is more reasonable than a lot of other electric bikes and the savings in fuel costs would bring quick payback, particularly here in Europe where we pay fuel prices that would give you people in the US a big shock. If the firm starts marketing the bike here in Europe rather than in the US, it could be onto a winner amongst commuters. I live in London and a lot of people ride small scooters to get to work – this would offer similar ease of use but for lower running costs.
Scotduke says
Bear in mind that the premium fuel I put in my Ducati here in London the other day costs US$7.41/US gallon.
And by the way, there have been numerous reports about low noise electric vehicles posing safety hazards, particularly for those with poor vision. There is a Japanese study on the subject. I think noise generators will be a requirement for electric vehicles at some point.
Marneyman says
When they trebel or quadruple the range for that price, and get us 20 more MPH I’ll get in line. I have every confidence that it will happen sooner rather than later. It’s an impressive first effort to be sure.
LittleTurtle says
@ Pabsy
http://pnwriders.com/general-discussion/114126-test-ride-brammo-enertia.html
There’s the link to the rider test ride.
http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2009/11/brammo-enertia-drops-price-to.html
That’s the link to the independent verification of speed.
http://brammofan.wordpress.com/
Where I get a lot of my Brammo news. And NO the guy who writes that blog is not a Brammo employee or getting compensation in any way for the blog. He just realizes that Brammo has a great product (now for a reasonable price), and has the time to blog about it.
Also Check out http://www.ShockingBarack.com that was is put out by Brammo but the videos don’t lie.
@Freeman – To answer your question: Hills? what hills? True the hills do take more energy to go up (laws of physics, can’t break those as easy), but just give it some more throttle and it’s awesome. I usually drive a diesel Jetta, which has lots of torque and handles hills easy. The Enertia is in a different class all together. I think one of the things I liked the most in my test ride was the fact that you had a strong CONSTANT pull of acceleration all the way from 0 to 60, no lurch shift lurch shift of transmission.
@ Everybody – Reserve your skepticism until you’ve ridden one. Everyone I’ve talked to about their test ride has come away with an awesome experience, regarles of how skeptical they were before.
Check out this entry from http://www.ShockingBarack.com
“When we emerged from Adrian City Hall there was a throng of people surrounding the bikes, including a bunch of construction workers, including one guy, John Lueder, who’s hardhat was covered with motorcycle stickers.
Choppers Inc, Wiseco Pistons, etc, etc. The kind of guy who wouldn’t be caught dead on an EV. Well one thing leads to another, and Brian hands him the keys to the Enertia. Then he was gone. For an uncomfortably long time.
And when he finally came whizzing by, he yells out, “I’m not bringing it back.†Eventually he did, with an ear-to-ear grin and a new outlook on the power of electricity.”
Enough said?
David/cigarrz says
little turtle
Did I read in your previous post that you don’t own a motorcycle and that you dismissed owning one till you found brammo? I can understand your enthusiasm for tax payers covering half of the cost (who doesn’t like fun at someone else’s expense) but what part of the two wheel experience did the brammo finally provide for you to decide to purchase one in the future? Does the fact that mining the materials needed for lithium batteries is an ecological disaster in third world countries give you pause?
todd says
I think the initial market (California) is appropriate for a low speed, electric. There aren’t a lot of places you can get out and open it up for any reasonable amount of time before having to turn (out in the country) or stop (in the city). For the rest of The Union that is covered with uninterrupted arrow straight highways, empty towns, and precious few mountain roads Harleys probably make more sense.
That said, California also happens to be a land in abundance of excellent condition, inexpensive, used motorcycles, Craigslist, and high debt-to-income ratios. I wish Brammo luck in this environment.
I also think this is one of the best looking motorcycles available today. If it had a 350 single in it I would be all over it – even at $7k+. I’ll at least go check Brammo out at the upcoming motorcycle show.
-todd
Bob Nedoma says
Good shot David/c.
……….. salts used in lithium battery electrolytes are lithium bromide, lithium perchlorate, lithium tetrafluoroborate, and/or lithium hexafluorophosphate.
Alternately, it’s lead and H2SO4, very nasty when spilled, often “recycled” by the way of exporting old junk to third world and using child labour to recover some lead.
Yet another hoop our environment has to leap through, unless we have a full, complete and foolproof recycling program in place before they even start producing or selling anything like this. I don’t think they do.
Pabsy makes lot of sense.!!
FREEMAN says
@ cigarrz and nedoma: It’s annoying that this comes up every time there’s a post about electric vehicles. Nevermind what gas vehicles have already done, we need to sock it to the electrics and make anybody that considers one out to be heartless/inconsiderate/vain/a villain. Seriously, it’s getting old. Can I refer you two to this post?
David/cigarrz says
It may be annoying but hardly irrelevant. I found it interesting that someone not a motorcyclist was so enthused, it certainly would be insight for consideration by all manufactures of 2 wheelers. I am also not willing to repeat the same ecological disasters petroleum has caused just because it’s “green” electric pollution. It seems your confusing politics with the discussion on the brammo and its merits or is this a point of faith.
FREEMAN says
@ cigarrz: the whole “green” movement is nothing but politics and very hypocritical at best. It doesn’t make sense that it should apply more so to batteries than fuel, especially given your non-recited “ecological disasters petroleum has caused.”
pabsy says
Little Turtle
Thanks for the links regarding this one http://www.ShockingBarack.com do they mean to tell us they drove 2 brammos halfway across the country for 30-50 miles at a time then stopping 4hours to recharge, rinse and repeat until arriving at destination !!!
btw the blogger ShockingBarack that owns one inidicated 20 per re charges for ‘top” speed ie a short highway commute
im not trying to be fascitious but really thats hilarious and hardly makes their point
pabsy says
you know whats intersting about this debate is there is actually very little disagreement, its fascinating, here is what i mean.
i think reasonable folks (and this seems a reasonable crowd) can mostly agree on the following:
1 the bike looks really cool and is nicely built with good specs
2 it is a fun fun easy ride for newbies and experts alike
3 the purchase cost is double what equivelant ice machines cost (ignoring the poor range for the moment otherwise there is no comparison!)
4 the per mile cost (ignoring resale and insurance cos i dont know em) is about double an equivelant ice machine (please dont make me do the math.. 🙂
5 its performance in range, recharge and speed limits it to single riders on modest routes
6 a clean quiet greaseless, unsmelly ride is very desirable and broadens the biker base
7 the thought of an all electric bike is super cool and we all want one !!
how about that ?
so where is the disagreement ? the disagreement is wether you feel the technology is good for us, if you do then your willing to accept the poor performance and economics and that is totally fine too !!
the problem occurs when those who want the tech so badly, comparitive ressoning goes out of the window, crazy justifucation are made and arguments get heated
my opinion is i want this really badly, but i am practical to the fact that the price / performance is not only not there yet its insanely impractical and that harms the cause in the long run because it just makes the tech a joke when it fails and tarnishes it
ok end of ramble but the conclusion is this, the ONLY problem the point of dissagreement is the gas tank aka the battery its the source of all evil ! as follows:
when we get a battery that has 10times the capacity we have now, charges and discharges in a minute and isn’t made of carcenogens, there will be no heated debate ! we’ll all agree that electric vehicles are staggeringly good and well all want one, it will be a no brainer
gpPeej says
It seems that Brammo has sidestepped the traditional dealers network. Placement in BB stores will get the bike seen by many potential new riders. I like the bike and wish them luck.
Here’s the part I don’t understand…How is it legal to sell this Motor Vehicle from a big box retailer??? Dealerships in my state require state dealership licenses, sevice agreements, garage keepers insurance, dmv reporting, licensed salespeople, extra permits, safety inspections and liability insurance. Is BestBuy really going to go throught that for each location that stocks the bike? The established dealers network will surely be watching for compliance issues that will vary in each state. And if this sales model works can we expect to see other motorcycles on sale at BigBoxes? Kawasaki at Kmart? Target Honda?
Peej
Keith says
gpPeej brings up an excellent point. Is BB going to handle all the paperwork, or make you do it yourself? That’s an awful lot of DMV hassle that may negate some of the benefits of getting the bike in front of new potential customers.
bblix says
How do they get around the DMV? Easy…it’s not a motorcycle. Here in Missouri if you’ve got an ICE that’s under 50cc (maybe a certain hp limit too) with a maximum speed of less than 25 or 30mph you are not required to license the vehicle…
I wonder if this doesn’t fall outside the category in some fashion, thus avoiding the hassles of licensing.
todd says
In California, if it goes over 45 mph (edited recently) and can be “defined as a motorcycle” according to other codes then it is a motorcycle. Apparently it’s not that hard to become a dealer (a MUST to legally sell a DOT vehicle). Here’s the requirements from CA DMV’s web site:
The fees to become a licensed dealer are:
* $150 Non-refundable application fee
* $1 Family Support Program fee
* $70 For each branch location (if applicable)
* $57 For each dealer plate and $59 for each motorcycle plate (plus county fees, if applicable). (This figure will vary depending on the county where your business is located.)
* $225 New Motor Vehicle Board Fee, per location (new automobile, commercial, motorcycle, ATV, motorhome, and recreational trailer dealers only)
* $50 Autobroker Endorsement fee
This wouldn’t require too much effort from BB.
-todd
Azzy says
I’ll wait and see what Best Buy’s track record is on these things. If they get sold in the same way that everything else in those stores are sold, then the brand will suffer a huge black eye as unseuspeciting people are told lies again and again before tehy purchase, and be ignored when it comes time for repair or service.
Or the bikes could be handled differently than computers. I doubt it, but will just wait and see.
frozen prairie says
gpPeej,
In the sixties Sears sold Alstate motorcycles in their stores and catalogs. I think they were re-badged Jawas, though maybe they were Puchs or Zundaps, something European anyway. In my little mining town in the Canadian Shield, the Hudson Bay department store sold Hondas: just the 50cc bikes at first, then all the way up to the 450 “Black Bomber”.
I don’t know what people did for service. Just did it themselves (and often badly) I’d guess.
After a year or two of use there are many things that will need servicing, even on a Brammo, that many owners, especially if they are new to “motorcycling”, can’t do themselves – steering head adjustment, brake work, fork seals, etc. They could just take it to a ‘real” motorcycle dealership, I guess. After all, lots of people buy Walmart bicycles, then take them to a bicycle shop for servicing, so the same could happen with the Brammo.
Some posters here have mentioned the cost of the Brammo. I say it’s unfair to compare its price to that of used ICE bikes. You could compare the cost of new and used ICE machines and find that the new ones were not worth the asking price…. Where would we be if no one bought new bikes? Paying premium prices for used ones, probably.
I’m hoping the Brammo is a success, sales-wise and technology-wise.
Ash says
I am 23 years old and I in California. I have never owned a bike and never thought I would. I bought a X-Treme for $1,000 today from BB and was VERY disappointed because it broke in 4 hours. I am now looking into getting a Brammo but I am not sure about it. I commute about 25 miles per day.
My main concern is that I don’t want to go through the hassle of DMV, getting a license for riding motorcycles (training and passing the test), buying insurance, getting a license plate, paying all the fees, and etc. So I am not sure if this is a good option for me or not. Maybe it is not as hard as I think it is; any ideas? I can’t seem to make up my mind. Please help and let me know your thoughts.
todd says
Ash, it’s really no bother and once you get your license you’ll be proud you did. You can also just get your permit with a written test. It’s good for a year and can be renewed every year. You just can’t ride after dark, on the freeway, or have a passenger with a permit. You could probably fill out the registration form after you took your written test. You’d already be at the DMV anyway.
Let us know how it all works out!
-todd
Jimmy says
Most of you guys are a perfect example as to why the U.S. is on its way down and will soon no longer be a super power. There used to be a time when innovative ideas and thinking outside the box got “pats†on the back instead of just criticisms! We KNOW this motorbike is not as fast as a gas powered bike; but it is an option if nothing else. Sure, it may cost more money, but what new technology doesn’t!? When they first invented cars I am sure people were saying “My horse Bessie is just fine for me!†Give these innovative thinkers people a chance. Do we plan to be slaves to the oil producing countries for the rest of our lives! These individuals who are complaining will be the same ones crying when gas gets close to $4/gallon this summer!