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	<title>Comments on: High gas prices &#8211; Smile!</title>
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	<description>Motorcycle News for Positive People</description>
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		<title>By: kneeslider</title>
		<link>http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2005/09/22/high-gas-prices-smile/comment-page-1/#comment-4003</link>
		<dc:creator>kneeslider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Sep 2005 20:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=570#comment-4003</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not talking about bad car quality or questionable designs like a Pacer or Pinto, I&#039;m talking about smog controls and drivability. Were the Big 3 perfect? Of course not. Did they make mistakes? Absolutely. I guess I never saw the perfect and mistake free company to which they are being compared.

I get a kick out of all of the hindsight many people have, especially the ones who weren&#039;t there. I speak from experience with a lot of cars from before, during and through that period, having driven and owned many at that time. Among those I owned were a 72 Jaguar E Type, a 73 Mercury Capri (German) and a 73 Toyota so I can also mention cars from across both ponds.

If you get a chance to drive a car from the 70&#039;s today, before you pronounce judgement on how it responds, make sure all of the original smog equipment is still on it. That was the first thing to go when many enthusiasts got their hands on one because the car wouldn&#039;t run with all of it connected. It&#039;s also why that early smog equipment is in such big demand by restorers. They can buy an old car but the smog gear is missing. 

The problem was that stringent emission regulations were put in place and engine controls were extremely primitive by today&#039;s standards. Engines used carbs, not fuel injection and ignition curves were altered by changing weights and springs inside the distributor, hardly an exact science. This was also the period when leaded gasoline was going away due to the coming of catalytic converters. Car makers had their hands full and it took time for them to figure things out. At the same time, they were also trying to meet a lot of new safety regulations, which is why there were so many cars with huge rubber bumper blocks added which looked pretty bad. My 72 Jag was the last year before that abomination took place on the E Type.

In today&#039;s world of computer controlled engines where almost everything can be changed with a laptop, it&#039;s easy to criticize the early efforts to make all of this happen. Working with the technology available, they made great strides, some of the cars still ran awful but they were trying.

The funny (or sad) thing about a lot of criticism is that it doesn&#039;t acknowledge the progress made. &quot;Wow, look where we were and how far we&#039;ve come!&quot; Instead, some vision of perfection is imagined and anything falling short is attributed to laziness, dishonesty or even some moral failure. (I wonder how many critics have reached such a state of perfection they are able to withstand the criticism of all others)

My comment about hybrids is right on the mark. Look back in 10 years and see what today&#039;s Prius looks like in terms of technology from that future date. Technology takes time to sort itself out and if you wait a few years you&#039;ll be able to get a lot more hybrid (or something else entirely?) than you can buy today. In the meantime, relax and smile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not talking about bad car quality or questionable designs like a Pacer or Pinto, I&#8217;m talking about smog controls and drivability. Were the Big 3 perfect? Of course not. Did they make mistakes? Absolutely. I guess I never saw the perfect and mistake free company to which they are being compared.</p>
<p>I get a kick out of all of the hindsight many people have, especially the ones who weren&#8217;t there. I speak from experience with a lot of cars from before, during and through that period, having driven and owned many at that time. Among those I owned were a 72 Jaguar E Type, a 73 Mercury Capri (German) and a 73 Toyota so I can also mention cars from across both ponds.</p>
<p>If you get a chance to drive a car from the 70&#8217;s today, before you pronounce judgement on how it responds, make sure all of the original smog equipment is still on it. That was the first thing to go when many enthusiasts got their hands on one because the car wouldn&#8217;t run with all of it connected. It&#8217;s also why that early smog equipment is in such big demand by restorers. They can buy an old car but the smog gear is missing. </p>
<p>The problem was that stringent emission regulations were put in place and engine controls were extremely primitive by today&#8217;s standards. Engines used carbs, not fuel injection and ignition curves were altered by changing weights and springs inside the distributor, hardly an exact science. This was also the period when leaded gasoline was going away due to the coming of catalytic converters. Car makers had their hands full and it took time for them to figure things out. At the same time, they were also trying to meet a lot of new safety regulations, which is why there were so many cars with huge rubber bumper blocks added which looked pretty bad. My 72 Jag was the last year before that abomination took place on the E Type.</p>
<p>In today&#8217;s world of computer controlled engines where almost everything can be changed with a laptop, it&#8217;s easy to criticize the early efforts to make all of this happen. Working with the technology available, they made great strides, some of the cars still ran awful but they were trying.</p>
<p>The funny (or sad) thing about a lot of criticism is that it doesn&#8217;t acknowledge the progress made. &#8220;Wow, look where we were and how far we&#8217;ve come!&#8221; Instead, some vision of perfection is imagined and anything falling short is attributed to laziness, dishonesty or even some moral failure. (I wonder how many critics have reached such a state of perfection they are able to withstand the criticism of all others)</p>
<p>My comment about hybrids is right on the mark. Look back in 10 years and see what today&#8217;s Prius looks like in terms of technology from that future date. Technology takes time to sort itself out and if you wait a few years you&#8217;ll be able to get a lot more hybrid (or something else entirely?) than you can buy today. In the meantime, relax and smile.</p>
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		<title>By: aaron</title>
		<link>http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2005/09/22/high-gas-prices-smile/comment-page-1/#comment-4000</link>
		<dc:creator>aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:15:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=570#comment-4000</guid>
		<description>i don&#039;t know if cars were bad in the early 70&#039;s due to emmissions controls, or the big three&#039;s unwillingness to create a good product.  I&#039;ve driven an early 911 (&#039;73? give or take a year) and throttle response and power were good.  I doubt the beatle lost driveabiliy or power, in fact wasn&#039;t the super beatle created around then?  a new car for the primary market due to a change in law.  I can&#039;t say i&#039;ve sampled pre and post jags, mg&#039;s or any of the french/italian cars, but the 70&#039;s was the upswing of foreign sales in north america.  big three&#039;s tactic was &quot;strangle the big motors, (take &#039;em out past 500 cubic inches if we have to) and build small cars, but we don&#039;t have to build them well.&quot;  remember the pacer, gremlin, chevette, pinto, etc?  I found a quote from gm chairman robert lutz that actually owns up to the attitude to small cars in america in those days (but gm defenders will, no doubt, still have a good reason to defend their brand of choice&#039;s dedication to quality)

Lutz said U.S. automakers are better positioned than in the past to make appealing small cars.

&quot;I think the American industry has stopped considering (small cars) as commodity vehicles,&quot; Lutz said.

&quot;There used to be a view expressed: &#039;Hey, let&#039;s just make these cars. Nobody cares about them. Nobody cares whether they are bad or good. It&#039;s for the people who can&#039;t afford anything better, and price is the only thing that counts.&#039; &quot;  (from autoweek.com)

wow.  chalk that one up, next to &quot;the equation&quot; for gm&#039;s good sense and empathy for the consumers

the equation - see fight club.  I don&#039;t have the energy to find the reference i have stacked somewhere in my library, besides my fingers are tired from all this typing.  the equation paraphrased goes &quot;if we build a flawed car, and the estimated cost of paying out injury and death compensation is less than redesigning the car,  F**K IT.&quot;


otherwise i agree with everything else you say, my only issue was with emissions regulations alone making for the &quot;awful cars&quot; of the 70&#039;s.

i say bring on five dollar gas.  that way, i won&#039;t have to worry about ten dollar gas in 2015.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i don&#8217;t know if cars were bad in the early 70&#8217;s due to emmissions controls, or the big three&#8217;s unwillingness to create a good product.  I&#8217;ve driven an early 911 (&#8217;73? give or take a year) and throttle response and power were good.  I doubt the beatle lost driveabiliy or power, in fact wasn&#8217;t the super beatle created around then?  a new car for the primary market due to a change in law.  I can&#8217;t say i&#8217;ve sampled pre and post jags, mg&#8217;s or any of the french/italian cars, but the 70&#8217;s was the upswing of foreign sales in north america.  big three&#8217;s tactic was &#8220;strangle the big motors, (take &#8216;em out past 500 cubic inches if we have to) and build small cars, but we don&#8217;t have to build them well.&#8221;  remember the pacer, gremlin, chevette, pinto, etc?  I found a quote from gm chairman robert lutz that actually owns up to the attitude to small cars in america in those days (but gm defenders will, no doubt, still have a good reason to defend their brand of choice&#8217;s dedication to quality)</p>
<p>Lutz said U.S. automakers are better positioned than in the past to make appealing small cars.</p>
<p>&#8220;I think the American industry has stopped considering (small cars) as commodity vehicles,&#8221; Lutz said.</p>
<p>&#8220;There used to be a view expressed: &#8216;Hey, let&#8217;s just make these cars. Nobody cares about them. Nobody cares whether they are bad or good. It&#8217;s for the people who can&#8217;t afford anything better, and price is the only thing that counts.&#8217; &#8221;  (from autoweek.com)</p>
<p>wow.  chalk that one up, next to &#8220;the equation&#8221; for gm&#8217;s good sense and empathy for the consumers</p>
<p>the equation &#8211; see fight club.  I don&#8217;t have the energy to find the reference i have stacked somewhere in my library, besides my fingers are tired from all this typing.  the equation paraphrased goes &#8220;if we build a flawed car, and the estimated cost of paying out injury and death compensation is less than redesigning the car,  F**K IT.&#8221;</p>
<p>otherwise i agree with everything else you say, my only issue was with emissions regulations alone making for the &#8220;awful cars&#8221; of the 70&#8217;s.</p>
<p>i say bring on five dollar gas.  that way, i won&#8217;t have to worry about ten dollar gas in 2015.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Kevin White</title>
		<link>http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2005/09/22/high-gas-prices-smile/comment-page-1/#comment-3996</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin White</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Sep 2005 16:49:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=570#comment-3996</guid>
		<description>Wow, well said!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, well said!</p>
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